published Thursday, February 9th, 2012

Mayfield for Congress

about Clay Bennett...

The son of a career army officer, Bennett led a nomadic life, attending ten different schools before graduating in 1980 from the University of North Alabama with degrees in Art and History. After brief stints as a staff artist at the Pittsburgh Post-Gazette and the Fayetteville (NC) Times, he went on to serve as the editorial cartoonist for the St. Petersburg Times (1981-1994) and The Christian Science Monitor (1997-2007), before joining the staff of the ...

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moonpie said...

Point taken, Clay. But I don't find it advantageous to under estimate anyone.

February 9, 2012 at 12:40 a.m.
Livn4life said...

This cartoon by the all talented and award-winning drawboy just shows the assumption that Scotty Mayfield doesn't know what he's doing. How dare anyone be so presumptuous? Sorry moonpie, I don't take the point. I see a slam which proves where Mr. Bennett stands. But then we knew that. Another tasteless assuming drawdown suprises no one. The truth is we have no idea how Scotty would do in politics. It is not cute to make assumptions.

February 9, 2012 at 6:04 a.m.
cactus said...

Clay would depict Mr. Mayfield as a matador if he was a democrat.

February 9, 2012 at 6:22 a.m.
EaTn said...

Come on folks, a humorous toon like this is more likely to help propel Scottie into the political limelight than hurt him. However, I'm not sure why anyone with a positive image from a quality product would want it drug through the political barnyard.

February 9, 2012 at 6:23 a.m.
MTJohn said...

I don't live in Tennessee and, before seeing this cartoon, I had never heard of Scott Mayfield. But, I get this one and it clearly has nothing to do with Mayfield's politics or political affiliations. The cartoon could have been about anyone, irrespective of affiliation, who is considering changing careers from managing a dairy business to making a run for Congress.

Clay has a remarkable ability to see irony and paint pictures to communicate that irony. You don't have to agree with him to learn something about the world around us from the irony that he portrays. But, to learn, you first have to be willing to think. And, it is not possible to think when your brain has been subordinated to ideology.

February 9, 2012 at 6:43 a.m.
woody said...

WAY TO GO, CLAY!! You have reached new heights in metaphor(ism). (If there wasn't such a word before there might be now.)

There is, as attested to above, so much 'bull' involved in the political process, why would anyone in their right mind want to willingly get involved in it.

Scotty, with all due respect to his background with bovines, would do well to continue 'milking' (pun intended) that which he knows the best..Woody

February 9, 2012 at 6:43 a.m.
fairmon said...

This candidate and cartoon is not consistent with the belief that anyone intelligent and honest enough to do the job is too intelligent to pursue the position. This candidate may have made the choice between a party establishment parrot and the 24 year old son of a former member of congress easy assuming the democcrats will only offer John Wolfe again.

February 9, 2012 at 7:16 a.m.
mountainlaurel said...

Livn4Life said: "I see a slam which proves where Mr. Bennett stands. But then we knew that. Another tasteless assuming drawdown suprises no one."

Indeed, we all see things differently, Livn4life. What I see in Bennett's cartoon is a nice guy who is leaving an honorable profession to enter what has become a dishonarble profession – a world as Woody so aptly notes that is full of bull. Personally, I think it takes a bit of courage to do this and believe more people should try it. . . . How about you, Woody?

February 9, 2012 at 7:18 a.m.

Well Clay once again takes a dig at anyone not in the political party he obviously in love with. With that said, I feel Mr. Mayfield will fit in great with politics and other politicians. Just look how his company has downsized it's serving size while increasing their prices. What used to be a half gallon of ice cream 2 quarts is now 1.5 quarts and it cost more. We as consumers just went along with it.

February 9, 2012 at 7:32 a.m.
dude_abides said...

One would hope that Scottie means to take the bull by the horns. If not, we should probably bring back the Sealtest brand.

February 9, 2012 at 7:39 a.m.
fairmon said...

ML said....

Indeed, we all see things differently, Livn4life. What I see in Bennett's cartoon is a nice guy who is leaving an honorable profession to enter what has become a dishonorable profession – a world as Woody so aptly notes that is full of bull. Personally, I think it takes a bit of courage to do this and believe more people should try it. . . . How about you, Woody?

Something we see the same way, finally and I say go for it Woody. Your straight forward approach and honesty make you a one termer, so what it would be a refreshing change.

February 9, 2012 at 8:51 a.m.
woody said...

Mountainlaurel, your post was 'on-the-money'. However, and only knowing what I hear about Mr. Mayfield, I would say he is one of the nicest businesspeople I have ever heard of which would, if elected, make him a true standout in any political arena.

But as badly as we need more people like Scottie(?) everywhere in politics, are we really willing to sacrifice him in order to finally discover the answer to that age-old question, "...is it the man who ruins the office, or the office which ruins the man...?"..Woody

February 9, 2012 at 9:03 a.m.
Walden said...

I'm very excited Mr. Mayfield has decided to enter the fray. I think he will make a wonderful representative for our district. There is hardly a more perfect candidate than a businessman with a moral compass pointed in the right direction; and, by the way, a little grey hair!

February 9, 2012 at 9:20 a.m.
LOL said...

http://www.knoxnews.com/news/2011/jul/14/dean-foods-announces-140-million-settlement/?print=1

Interesting article about price-fixing by Dean Foods, the parent company of Mayfield Farms.

February 9, 2012 at 9:53 a.m.
potcat said...

Once you go Haagen Dazs ice cream,there is no going back to Mayfields!! I like their Milk,but at over $5 a gallon, its a luxury. I am considering all my eating and drinking luxuries these days.

I have milked cows,my Mothers side had cows,my Dads pigs and both had chickens and farms so i am very much atuned to that aspect of life, i just wonder if Scotty is and if he ever even has had on a pair of overalls.

I still have the pair of cutoff overalls and my cousins Vietnam Army jacket that i wore as a teenager, needless to say my Mother was mortified.

February 9, 2012 at 11:01 a.m.
sage1 said...

"are we really willing to sacrifice him in order to finally discover the answer to that age-old question, ...is it the man who ruins the office, or the office which ruins the man...?"

Indeed....wouldn’t that be a great experiment? However, in today’s political campaigns, it's not about what you can and will do for the country that gets one elected, since we hear very little about that from our aspiring politicians. The one that loses is the one that gets hit in the face with the most mud, or that has the dirtiest laundry.

LOL has already fired the first shot.

February 9, 2012 at 11:40 a.m.
jesse said...

potcat's off his meds.again!

mayfield seems like the kind of folks we need in politics!

big change from what we got now!

February 9, 2012 at 1:15 p.m.
hambone said...

I like what Scotty Mayfield is not!

He is not a 24 year old "silver spoon" !

He is not a collections lawyer!!

He is not a failed businessman promising "term limits", YET!!

But, if he falls in lock-step with present GOP or Tea-Baggers.

I won't like him!!

February 9, 2012 at 1:31 p.m.
EaTn said...

Why is entering politics considered the next step up for those who've made it big in business? Have many really changed the system for the benefit of their community, state or country; or have many become part of the system to even further benefit themselves? I guess there's always hope.

February 9, 2012 at 2:58 p.m.
mountainlaurel said...

Woody said: “As badly as we need more people like Scotti everywhere in politics, are we really willing to sacrifice him in order to finally discover the answer to that age-old question, "...is it the man who ruins the office, or the office which ruins the man...?"

So you think it’s an 'act of cruelty' to help decent people get involved in politics? You’re probably right about this, Woody, but I think it has to done. Democracy is fragile thing that operates on principles that involve the good will of everybody, which seems to be missing. And although I’m inclined to distrust any politicians, I believe the Republicans have totally lost it. Clearly, they’re in urgent need of decent people. Indeed, I believe much of what Dean has to say in his “Gaming America Democracy’ series is 'on the money' and the tea party is only the tip of iceberg:

“Conservatives are now demanding and enforcing absolute GOP party discipline, and trying to impose it at all levels of government, tolerating no exceptions. They are willing to shut down any and all government operations if that is needed to serve their interest and get their way. They recognize no comity or courtesy in any cross-party situations that are not to their advantage. They have made civility the exception, rather than the rule. They will lie and mislead to accomplish what is necessary and conservative “thinkers” have abandoned intellectual honesty for the cause. They are hell-bent on changing as many processes of government as possible to always favor Republican rule, whether they are in the minority or majority. They are changing the rules by which we elect officials to favor the election and selection of conservative Republicans. They are making it more difficult for anyone who is not a Republican to vote.

They are blatantly engaging in extreme obstructionism to damage any non-Republican incumbent office-holder’s ability to perform in office. They operate behind closed doors whenever possible and always when in power. To accomplish their goals, they are raising and injecting literally countless billions—I repeat, billions—of dollars into manipulating local, state, and national legislative actions and elections to their advantage. Finally, they have—almost inconspicuously—altered every branch and level of government as they have proceeded. No one has seriously challenged these efforts, but surely others can see the activities I have noticed, and the pattern they reveal. Democrats, it appears, have decided to look the other way, and only when public outrage has erupted—as happened in Wisconsin, when Governor Scott Walker’s efforts to change the process became conspicuous—has there been any effort to prevent them from operating outside traditional conventional constitutional boundaries. So they continue, and in some areas, they are becoming increasingly aggressive.”

http://verdict.justia.com/2011/09/23/gaming-american-democracy

February 9, 2012 at 3:55 p.m.
fairmon said...

ML said....

has there been any effort to prevent them from operating outside traditional conventional constitutional boundaries. So they continue, and in some areas, they are becoming increasingly aggressive.”

What is the difference in traditional conventional constitutional boundaries and constitutional boundaries as it is written? Are you suggesting violations can only be attributed to one of the parties? Surely you jest! A hex on gov. Walker "IF" he violated the constitution. I assume you will tell me what violation occurred and what the penalty or corrective action for such is supposed to be.

February 9, 2012 at 4:19 p.m.
potcat said...

Potcat doesn't take meds, but jesse you should get checked out if you consider what i wrote as someone on/off meds.

Milking the cow or hehe the Bull wearing overalls,that was the cartoon, right jesse?

February 9, 2012 at 4:53 p.m.
jesse said...

to me the cartoon was "does mayfield know what he's gittin into ?"

politics ain't bossy the mild mannerd cow but a mexican fighting bull that will jump up and down on you if ain't carefull!!

maybe turn a nice ,honest person like mayfield into a nancy palosi or barak obama!

February 9, 2012 at 5:25 p.m.
potcat said...

That is not what the cartoon said to me, Jesse. Scoty Mayfield is the Son of the son of the original Mayfield Dairy business patriarch. He has probaly never milked a cow in his silver spoon fed baby mouth. He wouldn't know the difference between a cow or a bull.

You know how Republicans like to manufacture cowboys, when they are Rich, not from hard work but on Daddys or Granddaddys coatails.

How do we know he is honest, afterall he is Republican. That is very telling to me.

February 9, 2012 at 6:22 p.m.
jesse said...

in the cartoon he is prob.feelin like obama after two weeks in office !!

like "HEY COACH ,WHAT DO I DO NOW??"

obama has been a dead loss,so has our currant rep.in congress! we got losers every where so MAYBE mayfield would be a breath of freah air for a while till the system corrupts him too!!

give the man a chance,you just hate eveybody potcat!!

February 9, 2012 at 6:35 p.m.
potcat said...

I don't hate, its just a opinion, big difference.

February 9, 2012 at 7:04 p.m.
fairmon said...

potcat has almost convinced me the best candidate would be a homeless street person or that is a democrat. Is it time for an amendment that list the attributes a candidate must have such as citizenship, age, experience required, maximum wealth allowed, eliminated if wealth is inherited, no relatives in political office in the past 10 years, must have had cow dung and chicken litter on your shoes at some point in time etc. etc..

potcat said...

How do we know he is honest, afterall he is Republican, that is very telling to me.

mmmmm that statement could be very telling about the person saying it. I don't think either party label equals trustworthy nor does it mean not trustworthy. They are pretty equal in idiots also.

February 9, 2012 at 8:41 p.m.
acerigger said...

harp3339 said... "potcat said...

How do we know he is honest, afterall he is Republican, that is very telling to me."

Telling indeed! Shows that potcat is paying attention!

February 9, 2012 at 8:56 p.m.
carlB said...

For those that did not read Mayfield's first news release before he had decided to "formally run," the things he said in the release about what he knew about the political affairs amounted to what Clay's "cartoon" is indicating.

jesse said... in the cartoon he is prob.feelin like obama after two weeks in office !! like "HEY COACH ,WHAT DO I DO NOW??" obama has been a dead loss,so has our currant rep.in congress! we got losers every where so MAYBE mayfield would be a breath of freah air for a while till the system corrupts him too!!

give the man a chance,you just hate eveybody potcat!!

jesse, are you letting your biased judgment show when sticking to the talking points of President Obama's opponents in throwing out that "Obama has been a dead loss"? What were the differences if the conditions/situations of the Republic when Bush W. was elected and when President Obama took the office?
There are differences of what President Obama has to do, compared to what "Chuck" has to do.

February 9, 2012 at 10:37 p.m.

Ace, just how honest are those hypocritical democrats that you are so in love with? Not at all that is how much. There is no such thing as an honest politician, they all tell you what you want to hear then NEVER do as they say.

February 9, 2012 at 10:41 p.m.
acerigger said...

love,I thought you knew, they're ALL liars!

February 9, 2012 at 11:25 p.m.
woody said...

Well, I've finally come with a viable solution..all we have to do is find another 400-some odd businesspersons who, like Mayfield, are good business-people, not all that greedy and willing to work for a mere fraction of what they may be used to in order to set our country back on the path of economic stability and prosperity.

Simple..right? But that's the only way it's going to get done..Good luck Scottie..Woody

February 10, 2012 at 6:53 a.m.
MTJohn said...

harp3339 said...Is it time for an amendment that list the attributes a candidate must have such as citizenship, age, experience required, maximum wealth allowed, eliminated if wealth is inherited, no relatives in political office in the past 10 years, must have had cow dung and chicken litter on your shoes at some point in time etc. etc..

It's time for an amendment that mandates integrity, a commitment to selflessness and, a commitment to consistently serve the collective best interests of all citizens, not just those who voted for the candidate. Unfortunately, I don't know how to measure those attributes.

As a footnote, I might be kidding myself, but I have a sense that the measure integrity, as I just defined it, was greater among politicians in both parties a generation or two ago. It is also my sense that We, the people, no longer value politicians who are committed to serving all of us. It is not possible for a country divided by selfish ideology to elect people with integrity.

February 10, 2012 at 7:38 a.m.
potcat said...

Well hell fire damn, i wake up this am and find Potcat in almost every post.

Harp, you know i don't support either Party. The cartoon is about a Republican. Democrats are big Fat LIars also with Obama in the lead, ok.

February 10, 2012 at 7:41 a.m.
carlB said...

woody said...Mayfield, are good business-people, not all that greedy and willing to work for a mere fraction of what they may be used to in order to set our country back on the path of economic stability and prosperity. Simple..right? But that's the only way it's going to get done..Good luck Scottie..Woody -====== woody, You're being too much of a realist. The wage gap caused by the global economy has already taken it's toll on the manufacturing workers and the service workers. This has cut off the flow of money from the bottom to the top, but those at the top continue to keep cutting out the expense of the middle class tax base without reducing the cost of living for the forced increase of people living in "poverty." The Politicians' have not cut their wages and benefits and are still talking about getting good paying jobs and getting an education without regrowing the available private sector jobs for our citizens when the private sector enterprise systems are only looking at the maximum profit. That is why our unfair trade agreements have been increasing since 1973. The jobs will never come back from the other lower total cost countries until we can compete on a level playing field and under the conditions the US workers cannot compete when the global corporations have taken away the "balance" of where the goods are made with a lower total cost. Now we cannot support the way this country was doing business as it peaked before the unfair trade agreements allowed the increasing trade deficit with these corporate monopolies having their goods manufactured in other countries. If these global corporations have the right to move out of the USA, then the people also have the right to not buy and create a trade deficit of $500 to $600 billion dollars per year with these global corporations.

February 10, 2012 at 8:05 a.m.
fairmon said...

potcat said... Well hell fire damn, i wake up this am and find Potcat in almost every post.

Harp, you know i don't support either Party. The cartoon is about a Republican. Democrats are big Fat LIars also with Obama in the lead, ok.

I did think that we agreed on that. I apolegize for jumping to the wrong conclusion regarding your post.

February 10, 2012 at 8:39 a.m.
mountainlaurel said...

Harp3339 said: “Surely you jest! A hex on gov. Walker "IF" he violated the constitution. I assume you will tell me what violation occurred and what the penalty or corrective action for such is supposed to be.”

I haven’t been paying much attention to what has been happening in Wisconsin lately, but I assumed that Dean was referencing the VoterID issue, which has led to a lawsuit involving the constitution and equal protection of the law violaltions. But again I haven’t been paying a lot attention so Dean might be referencing a totally different issue. With Wisconsin, it's one bad happening after another. In the last article I read, one of Walker’s top aides had been arrested for stealing money from a military charity fund that was suppose to go to the families of Wisconsin soldiers who had been killed in Iraq and Afghanistan.

Did you read the rest of John Dean’s Gaming American Democracy, Harp3339? If so, what is your take on ALEC and their activities? I’m particularly unsettled by the fact that some of these corporations like Coca Cola, Kraft, ExxonMobile, Koch Industries, and Peabody are spending all this money trying to disenfranchise American voters. Indeed, I believe every American voter should file a lawsuit against the corporations funding this group.

“Based on CMD’s study of ALEC’s publicly available IRS tax returns, 98 percent of its funding comes from corporations and over the past three years, it has raised over $20 million—a sum with which you can develop and promote a lot of state legislation. According to Common Cause, ALEC’s corporate sponsors have further invested, during the last decade, more than $370 million in state elections, not including countless millions for and against state ballot measures, receiving a remarkable return on their investment in 2010.

http://verdict.justia.com/2011/10/07/gaming-american-democracy-2

February 10, 2012 at 9:53 a.m.
acerigger said...

I know it's off topic,but I find it fascinating,

A survey, conducted by Wenzel Strategies for World Net Daily, showed that one in five Republicans are leaning towards or would “definitely” re-elect the current president.

In contests against former Massachusetts Gov. Mitt Romney, former Pennsylvania Sen. Rick Santorum and former U.S. House Speaker Newt Gingrich, Obama got more than 20 percent of support from Republicans. In a matchup with Texas Congressman Ron Paul, 19 percent of Republicans chose the president.

February 10, 2012 at 11:51 a.m.
acerigger said...

tu_quoque ,when you make the assumption that I "put great stock in that web site and their polling company " you assume too much.

I put no "great stock" in ANY polling. As for the website,I certainly put no "great stock" in the far-right World "Nut"Daily. I wonder why they would even publish those results,unless it's to scare their wingnut readers!

February 10, 2012 at 5:15 p.m.
mountainlaurel said...

Tu_quoque said: "The man who was arrested did not work for Gov. Walker as he was only an employee in the former office of Milwaukee County Executive when Gov. Walker served in that office."

As I understand it, there have been a number of people arrested at this point for various reasons. Some were involved directly in Walker's campaign. As to the guy I mentioned in my earlier post to Harp3339, the info referred to him as a top aide:

“Tim Russell, a top aide of Wisconsin Governor Scott Walker, was arrested for stealing money from a military charity fund for families of Wisconsin soldiers killed in Iraq and Afghanistan. John Nichols joined MSNBC’s The Ed Show to explain this investigation’s impact on Walker, who is facing a possible recall election. “Even if he’s not personally tied to the wrongdoing,” says Nichols, “he seems to have very bad judgment in the people he hires and trusts.”

http://www.thenation.com/blog/165498/john-nichols-governor-scott-walker-has-bad-judgment

February 10, 2012 at 5:54 p.m.
fairmon said...

mountainlaurel said... Harp3339 said: “Surely you jest! A hex on gov. Walker "IF" he violated the constitution. I assume you will tell me what violation occurred and what the penalty or corrective action for such is supposed to be.”

You ML are indeed well qualified for political office in either party. Listen to the question instead of addressing it go to other opinions and allegations against those you don't agree. with as indicated by your following response to a question prompted by your allegation Walker had violated the constitution.

mountainlaurel responded with...

I haven’t been paying much attention to what has been happening in Wisconsin lately, but I assumed that Dean was referencing the Voter ID issue, which has led to a lawsuit involving the constitution and equal protection of the law violations. But again I haven’t been paying a lot attention so Dean might be referencing a totally different issue. With Wisconsin, it's one bad happening after another. In the last article I read, one of Walker’s top aides had been arrested for stealing money from a military charity fund that was suppose to go to the families of Wisconsin soldiers who had been killed in Iraq and Afghanistan.

ML?????? Was this unconstitutional behavior on the governors part? Has the governor defended him or intervened oh his behalf. If the allegations are true he should be severely punished but I don't see how his criminal behavior suggest a violation or disregard for the constitution by the governor.

ml further responded to the initial question with.....

Did you read the rest of John Dean’s Gaming American Democracy, Harp3339? If so, what is your take on ALEC and their activities? I’m particularly unsettled by the fact that some of these corporations like Coca Cola, Kraft, ExxonMobil, Koch Industries, and Peabody are spending all this money trying to disenfranchise American voters. Indeed, I believe every American voter should file a lawsuit against the corporations funding this group.

ML why would I bother to read a book by a convicted felon with a vendetta against his former political associates and contacts? Why would I accept his biased opinions unless it was something I wanted to hear and believe?

ML?????

What unconstitutional or illegal behavior did they engage in?

February 10, 2012 at 7:15 p.m.
fairmon said...

ML said...

“Based on CMD’s study of ALEC’s publicly available IRS tax returns, 98 percent of its funding comes from corporations and over the past three years, it has raised over $20 million—a sum with which you can develop and promote a lot of state legislation. According to Common Cause, ALEC’s corporate sponsors have further invested, during the last decade, more than $370 million in state elections, not including countless millions for and against state ballot measures, receiving a remarkable return on their investment in 2010.

What specifically did they achieve with their illegal and unconstitutional behavior? What was the rate of return on their investment? Are actively encouraging your elected officials to prohibit and political contributions from and source other than a maximum amount from identified individuals?

February 10, 2012 at 7:37 p.m.
mountainlaurel said...

Harp3339 said: “You ML are indeed well qualified for political office in either party. Listen to the question instead of addressing it go to other opinions and allegations against those you don't agree. with as indicated by your following response to a question prompted by your allegation Walker had violated the constitution.”

I believe you have managed to blurr the thoughts that I shared in my post, Harp3339, so let’s begin again. Shall we start from the beginning where you state: “Surely you jest! A hex on gov. Walker "IF" he violated the constitution. I assume you will tell me what violation occurred and what the penalty or corrective action for such is supposed to be.” [Harp3339]

I responded by sharing my thoughts on the matter and stated: “I assumed that Dean was referencing the Voter ID issue, which has led to a lawsuit involving the constitution and equal protection of the law violations. But again I haven’t been paying a lot attention so Dean might be referencing a totally different issue.” [MountainLaurel]

From there, Harp3339, I went on to add: With Wisconsin, it's one bad happening after another. In the last article I read, one of Walker’s top aides had been arrested for stealing money from a military charity fund that was suppose to go to the families of Wisconsin soldiers who had been killed in Iraq and Afghanistan. [MountainLaurel]

February 10, 2012 at 9:56 p.m.
mountainlaurel said...

Harp3339 said: “why would I bother to read a book by a convicted felon with a vendetta against his former political associates and contacts? Why would I accept his biased opinions unless it was something I wanted to hear and believe?”

As I recall, John Dean got in trouble because he was involved in the "cover-up" of the Watergate burglaries during the Nixon administration. As to John Dean's alleged vendetta, what is the basis for your claim, Harp3339? I’m just curious.

In regard to my question about getting your take on ALEC, it seems to me that you still could have answered my question. Afterall, John Dean is not the only person writing about the activities of the American Legislative Exchange Council, Harp3339. I have read numerous articles about this organization from a variety of news sources. In fact, some of our TFP posters were just discussing ALEC and an recent incident that occurred in Florida:

“It's been long speculated that Republican state lawmakers are taking their orders from the shadowy right-wing think tank funded by the Koch Brothers and known as the American Legislative Exchange Council (ALEC) -- and now there's proof.

It was discovered in Florida -- when Republican State Representative Rachel Burgin introduced legislation in the state House back in November that -- oops -- still included ALEC's mission statement at the top of the bill, reading: "Whereas it is the mission of the American Legislative Exchange Council to advance Jeffersonian principles..."

ALEC gathers lawmakers and corporate interests together to draft model legislation. . . Everything from stricter drug laws that help the private prison industry -- to anti-EPA laws that help the big oil industry -- to voter ID laws that help the Republican Party are produced by ALEC. It's become increasingly clear what's going on: we elect representatives -- and they represent corporations.”

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/thom-hartmann/how-alec-is-turning-our-d_b_1254574.html

February 10, 2012 at 10:04 p.m.
fairmon said...

Question to ML...A hex on gov. Walker "IF" he violated the constitution. I assume you will tell me what violation occurred and what the penalty or corrective action for such is supposed to be.” [Harp3339]

The comment and question resulted from your serious charge that the governor of Wisconsin had violated the constitution. Your response was you had ass-u-med someone named Dean was talking about a voter ID law. Then you commented about a former employee committing a crime, stealing charity funds) that became known when the governor ask the state DA to investigate the rumors.

They you jumped to your concerns about the ALEC and their mission "Whereas it is the mission of the American Legislative Exchange Council to advance Jeffersonian principles..." and ask me for my take on the ALEC.

ALEC is a legal organization with about 300 corporate members and over 2000 democrat and republican state legislator are members. I see nothing wrong with their efforts to exchange information among state legislatures and to help draft well written legislation consistent with their principles and I certainly see nothing wrong with the Jefferson principles. You may disagree with the ALEC ideals and the Jefferson principles but they haven't violated the constitution or law. What is your objection to the Jefferson principles?

I am sure you prefer the George Soros agenda while I think he may be the most dangerous man with substantial political influence in America that contributes liberally to many socialist causes and is a major Obama contributor including the maximum of $50,000 directly to his inauguration.

February 11, 2012 at 4:22 a.m.
fairmon said...

ML and SOS posted....

It was discovered in Florida -- when Republican State Representative Rachel Burgin introduced legislation in the state House back in November that -- oops -- still included ALEC's mission statement at the top of the bill, reading: "Whereas it is the mission of the American Legislative Exchange Council to advance Jeffersonian principles..."

SO what? Is the ALEC mission statement illegal or unconstitutional? I see no evidence they are trying to hide it.

February 11, 2012 at 4:35 a.m.
acerigger said...

harp3339 said... "SO what? Is the ALEC mission statement illegal or unconstitutional? I see no evidence they are trying to hide it."

Yep,they're pretty blatant about it.After all,who would even care that corporate interests are writing our laws?(snark)

February 11, 2012 at 10:38 a.m.
jesse said...

I THOUGHT the CARTOON was about scott mayfield!!

guess that's what i get for thinkin!!

same ole same ole!!

February 11, 2012 at 11:07 a.m.
acerigger said...

LOL Jesse!

February 11, 2012 at 12:56 p.m.
mountainlaurel said...

Harp3339 said: “The comment and question resulted from your serious charge that the governor of Wisconsin had violated the constitution. Your response was you had ass-u-med . . . Dean was talking about a voter ID law.”

And, Harp3339? Indeed, I do think the unethical activites of the State of Wisconsin’s Governor Scott Walker has led to rights violations in the constitution; and since a Federal lawsuit involving Wisconsin’s Voter ID law has been filed on behalf of some of the citizens in Wisconsin, I don’t believe that I’m the only person who feels this way.

As to my assumption about John Dean’s reference to Governor Walker, I qualified my comment simply because I remembered the Governor had been involved in an another scheme that would have denied the citizens in Wisconsin of their basic rights. In this scheme, Governor Walker - along with a group of his fellow Republicans – had tried to pass a bill that would deny the collective bargaining rights of the public workers in Wisconsin. Needless to say, the schemers went about it illegally - as unethical schemers like Governor Walker often do - and the bill was invalidated by a circuit court. In this particular scheme, they had set up a special meeting that violated the open meetings law in the State of Wisconsin.

Harp3339 said: “Then you commented about a former employee committing a crime, stealing charity funds) that became known when the governor ask the state DA to investigate the rumors.”

I don’t get your point, Harp3339. Surely, you’ve noticed a lot of shady stuff has been going on in the State of Wisconsin. If I had accused Governor Walker of conspiring with his aide to steal the charity money, I could understand your complaint, but I didn’t. Clearly, my comment was simply an observation related to all of the shady stuff going on in the State and provided one little example from a very long list of shady happenings.

February 11, 2012 at 1:21 p.m.
fairmon said...

ML said....

And, Harp3339? Indeed, I do think the unethical activities of the State of Wisconsin’s Governor Scott Walker has led to rights violations in the constitution; and since a Federal lawsuit involving Wisconsin’s Voter ID law has been filed on behalf of some of the citizens in Wisconsin, I don’t believe that I’m the only person who feels this way. Why has the justice department challenged the decisions he has made or the legislation approved? Is there a difference in Wisconsin's voter ID law and those of other states?

Obviously you aren't or there would be no lawsuit but innocent until proven guilty still applies. The possibility of recall is not a guilty or not guilty vote. It means those voting to recall don't like what he thinks is in the best interest of the state. Also assuming one is like his/her associations would do a lot of people in. Obviously prior associations would not change your opinion of Obama nor would you question his behavior due to those associations.

February 11, 2012 at 4:12 p.m.
mountainlaurel said...

Tu_quoque said: “You are aware that a half truth is not much different than a lie, do you not? The Wisconsin Supreme Court overruled the lower court, that no one’s “basic rights” were denied, and allowed the law to take effect. Thus, your above is total B.S. and renders you to the level of near liar.”

Thank-you for the update, Tu_quoque. As I was just telling Harp3339 earlier in this thread, I haven’t been keeping up with things in Wisconsin. There is simply too much going up there. Indeed, It’s been one bad happeing after another.

Speaking of which, perhaps, I should mention that after reading your post I did make an effort to update myself on the matter, and I noted that there have been new developments and the saga is still not over. . . and it looks like it might very well end up in the U.S. Supreme Court.

FROM DAILY KOS:

"Back in June, the Wisconsin State Supreme Court decided in a narrow, 4-3 ruling that Gov. Scott Walker's administration was allowed to start implementing its union-busting law. Now, it turns out that the law firm which the Walker administration hired to argue its case gave tens of thousands of dollars in free legal services to one of the four justices [Michael Gableman] that ruled in the administration's favor:

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2011/12/20/1047387/-Justice-who-cast-vote-for-Wisconsin-union-busting-law-got-over-$10K-from-law-firm-arguing-the-case

FROM MILWAUKEE WISCONSIN JOURNAL SENTINEL:

“State law bars public officials from receiving anything of value for free because of their position. Separately, the state's judicial ethics code prevents judges from accepting gifts from those who are likely to appear before them.”

“Since the firm started representing Gableman in the ethics case in July 2008, Gableman has participated in nine cases in which the court voted on substantive issues involving Michael Best clients. Gableman ruled in those clients' favor in five of those cases - more than any other justice.”

http://www.jsonline.com/news/statepolitics/gableman-voted-with-law-firm-after-receiving-free-legal-services-o53gc01-135904063.html

February 11, 2012 at 4:46 p.m.
mountainlaurel said...

Harp3339 said: “ALEC is a legal organization . . . I see nothing wrong with their efforts to exchange information among state legislatures and to help draft well written legislation consistent with their principles

Needless to say, I disagree, Harp3339. It seems to me that when two or more persons meet and try to figure out legal ways to suppress the voting rights of certain segments of our citizenry, it’s more than just a friendly exchange of information.

Indeed, some people believe the activities that went on between these corporations and our lawmakers in regard to these new voting laws to be a conspiracy against the right of persons to vote, which I’m told is a crime – but I guess time will tell. Justice moves slowly sometimes.

February 11, 2012 at 4:58 p.m.
fairmon said...

It seems to me that when two or more persons meet and try to figure out legal ways to suppress the voting rights of certain segments of our citizenry, it’s more than just a friendly exchange of information.

Are you concluding that requiring a voter ID is collusion on the part of a few to suppress voting rights? Whose voting rights would be suppressed? Would they be denied a free state issued picture ID?

If there is a law violation I hope they are prosecuted and persecuted. By the time a decision is reached we will probably be voting and paying for purchases with our cell phones.

February 11, 2012 at 5:27 p.m.
MTJohn said...

harp3339 said...Are you concluding that requiring a voter ID is collusion on the part of a few to suppress voting rights?

I am concluding that the various iterations of the recent voter ID laws are a collusion on the part of some to suppress the voting rights of others. And, I say that, because in spite of all of the ballyhoo, 1) they have been put forward as a solution for a problem that does not exist and 2) they will only affect one segment of the voting public, those folks who already have been disenfranchised.

February 11, 2012 at 5:38 p.m.
jesse said...

from the iterations of the recent posters on this thead we have a proliferation of arrogant,ignorant,self agrandising asshols who think they have the probs.of the world fig.out !AND how to solve them!they are ledgends in there own minds and NOWHERE ELSE!

February 11, 2012 at 6:08 p.m.
acerigger said...

jesse ,I don't think that these "arrogant,ignorant,self agrandising asshols who think they have the probs.of the world fig.out!AND how to solve them!" actually think that. They're just AWARE that these problems exist&need to be addressed!@

February 11, 2012 at 9:53 p.m.
fairmon said...

mountainlaurel said...

Indeed, some people believe the activities that went on between these corporations and our lawmakers in regard to these new voting laws to be a conspiracy against the right of persons to vote, which I’m told is a crime – but I guess time will tell. Justice moves slowly sometimes.

I have no preference regarding requiring or not requiring a voter picture ID. The number committing fraud and the number able to get to the polls to vote that can't obtain an ID are both so small it is not logical to think it will affect an election result. To think that it would means some people think that only one party is affected and that it will affect the results of an election.

A conspiracy against the rights of others for any reason should, in my opinion, be considered criminal. We could make a long list of politicians in both parties and many special interest groups associated with both parties possibly guilty of that.

February 12, 2012 at 1:38 a.m.
fairmon said...

jesse said...

from the iterations of the recent posters on this thead we have a proliferation of arrogant,ignorant,self agrandising asshols who think they have the probs.of the world fig.out !AND how to solve them!they are ledgends in there own minds and NOWHERE ELSE

acerigger said...

jesse ,I don't think that these "arrogant,ignorant,self agrandising asshols who think they have the probs.of the world fig.out!AND how to solve them!" actually think that. They're just AWARE that these problems exist&need to be addressed!@

It sounds like you are describing the current candidates for POTUS and the current POTUS except they haven't been posting on this thread, at least I don't think so. They do seem to have some parrots here.

February 12, 2012 at 1:50 a.m.
MTJohn said...

jesse said...from the iterations of the recent posters on this thead we have a proliferation of arrogant,ignorant,self agrandising asshols who think they have the probs.of the world fig.out !AND how to solve them!they are ledgends in there own minds and NOWHERE ELSE!

Jesse - if you had something rational to add to the conversation, you would not have to resort to name calling.

February 12, 2012 at 8:49 a.m.
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