published Wednesday, June 20th, 2012

'Society's shame,' indeed

Communist China has enacted some market reforms in recent decades and thus has enjoyed a fair degree of economic growth. But many of its social policies remain starkly brutal and repressive.

Not the least of those is its one-child policy -- enacted to hold down population.

A woman who cannot pay the equivalent of a $6,300 fine in order to have a second baby can be forced to abort her child.

That was on gruesome display with the savage killing by government officials of an unborn baby who was only weeks from birth. Not content to force the woman to abort her child, government officials cruelly beat her, as well, according to news accounts.

But someone was watching, and this time the government didn't get to play out its vicious tendencies with impunity. Photos of the woman beside her bloodied, dead infant were circulated on the Internet, and they were met with deserved revulsion and horror not only abroad but among Chinese citizens.

The totalitarian government felt the pressure. Though it offered no clear repudiation of its sickening one-child policy, it issued a statement on its official website labeling this particular forced abortion "society's shame." One commentary on the site "said the case exposed the lack of humanity in some administrative officials," The Associated Press reported.

And that decency deficit surprises exactly ... whom?

China's "Great Leap Forward" led to the deaths of perhaps 45 million of its citizens -- both from outright murder by the government and from needless famine that resulted from collectivist policies -- only a few decades ago. Countless religious and political dissidents have been killed or tortured in the intervening years. (Remember Tiananmen Square?)

This is not, in short, a government that is long on "humanity." It has nursed for decades on the blood of innocents.

So it is tragic but, in a sense, almost unremarkable that a mere Chinese citizen -- a lowly woman, no less -- should have been brutalized and her baby slaughtered in a nation steeped in officially sanctioned mayhem.

Why would the world expect anything different?

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nucanuck said...

China is rapidly re-inventing herself and is moving ahead with thoughtful long-term planning. We have more to learn from China than to criticize.

A Chinese exchange student who lived with our family for two years gave us a wonderful insight into China and the pride the Chinese have in their recent accomplishments. China seems capable of recognising her weak points and moving to correct them. It is that attitude that is propelling China into becoming a world leader.

June 20, 2012 at 12:48 a.m.
fairmon said...

I agree nucanuck. China is outsmarting our leaders on every front. China has the patience and long term planning to be successful. It is hard to imagine how large China is and how difficult it is to manage. We would be better served if those we elect addressed U.S. issues rather than trying to dictate to others how they should govern. Americans knowledge of China derives only from the press propaganda by many that have never visited that country and others that seek sensational events that sell publications. Foreign correspondents do the same with shameful U.S. events such as own wall street events and other protest and violence shown on TV.

June 20, 2012 at 4:49 a.m.
conservative said...

China chooses to murder the unborn, America allows the mother to chose to murder the unborn. There both "Society's shame!"

June 20, 2012 at 7:20 a.m.
Easy123 said...

Your grammar is a shame.

Who are you to decide what a woman can choose to do with her body? If you don't like abortion then don't get one. But it should be an option for women. Rape, incest, or if the baby is threatening the life of the mother are all scenarios where abortion is likely preferable. The issue isn't black and white like you make it out to be. There is plenty of grey area.

June 20, 2012 at 7:43 a.m.
dao1980 said...

conservative won't let anyone tell him what he can or can't do with his uterus... though, he loves to tell others what they can or can't do with theirs.

June 20, 2012 at 7:55 a.m.
conservative said...

easy....

Thanks for the grammar tip.

Your rape, incest, and life of the mother exceptions reveal that you have a moral standard for yourself but it is a standard sorely lacking when you purposely omit mentioning the millions of the unborn murdered for the sake of convenience.

June 20, 2012 at 8:27 a.m.
dao1980 said...

How many homeless starving children have you adopted today conservative?

Or does controlling others choices regarding potential life take priority for you over your choice to save and assist existing life.

These are questions you should consider seriously, our sky daddy will expect answers when you prance from this life on to magic eternal reward land to set up residence in your golden mansion at 1232 Golden St.

June 20, 2012 at 8:44 a.m.
librul said...

"This is not, in short, a government that is long on "humanity." It has nursed for decades on the blood of innocents."

Just as the U.S. has done from Nicaragua, Chile and El Salvador to Vietnam, Haiti, Pakistan, etc., etc. Anywhere that the needs and aspirations of poor people have run up against corporate profiteering by elitist capitalists and neocon thinktank fantasies of "full spectrum dominance", the good 'ol USA has been there with death squads, assasinations, invasions, puppet leaders and, now, drones which ignorant Americans see as expression of "revenge" for 911.

http://killinghope.org/

Remember, Mr. Editor, it was China that originated moveable type before Columbus and that 5,000 - 9,000 years ago, Chinese artisans lived in cultures that produced ceramics, bronzes, jade art and elaborate burials which boggle the mind; while caucasian Europeans were still wearing animal skins and engaged in seesaw warfare with that other notable empire from Rome.

http://factsanddetails.com/china.php?itemid=261

2,500 years ago, Confucius said "Before you embark on a journey of revenge, dig two graves."

June 20, 2012 at 8:46 a.m.
Easy123 said...

Conservative,

How could you know whether an abortion is for "convenience" or not? You couldn't possibly know that. And who are you to say whether "convenience" is a good enough reason or not? No one should have control over what a woman does with her own body. No one.

June 20, 2012 at 8:50 a.m.
Leaf said...

Make no mistake, China is no utopia. Their citizens do not enjoy the rights and due process we take for granted. Their giant manufacturing base causes massive pollution and appalling conditions for many of their workers. Their government meddles in the reproduction of its citizens. China's got a lot of things going for it, but it's hard to defend the human rights record.

June 20, 2012 at 9:42 a.m.
Livn4life said...

All you folk so in love with China, we have airplanes going that way. They are not like us, never have been, never will be even if they one day own us. We learn only what they want us to learn. While an exchange student may be a sampling NU of life there. In such a vast nation, it is by no means the total story. Oppression is the main feature. You comply or else... Their advancements have been gradual and I defy any of us to go there, live a year, return and say you'd love to live there the rest of your life.

June 20, 2012 at 10:21 a.m.
Easy123 said...

http://www.usatoday.com/news/world/2005-11-17-china-guide_x.htm

Their advancements have already surpassed ours. And Americans do live there. Quite a few actually.

June 20, 2012 at 10:28 a.m.
librul said...

I have no desire to live in a cage with either a Russian Bear or an Asian Tiger but trying to be comfortable in a cage with a nest of snakes including a corporate CEO, a commodities trader, an investment banker and a Pentagon planner would be no more pleasant.

June 20, 2012 at 10:36 a.m.
conservative said...

easy...

You play the moral card when you justify abortion on the grounds of rape, incest and saving the life of the mother which are only a small percentage of the number of abortions performed each year. You play the hypocrite when you dismiss the murder of over 1 million of the unborn by demanding that they have a right to do so.

Yes would be mothers had the legal right to take the lives of over 1 million of their unborn children last year but there was nothing moral about it. These 1 million plus unborn were aborted for the sake of convenience.

America shares the same shame of China regarding abortion.

June 20, 2012 at 10:47 a.m.
Easy123 said...

Conservative,

Again, how do you know the mother's reasoning for ANY abortion? Where do you get these "convenience" numbers? In church?

You have yet to answer that.

Also, who are you to decide what is right or wrong for someone else?

No, America doesn't share the same shame. Our women have a choice about their bodies. Women in China don't.

June 20, 2012 at 10:51 a.m.
lightkeeper said...

Conservatives are such hypocrites, they say they don't want "big brother" telling them or people what to do, then want to shove big brother up a womens you know where.

June 20, 2012 at 11:27 a.m.
conservative said...

easy...

Just so you know, I'm setting you up here. Look at he definition of the word convenience that I'm providing for you. Think about the definition and then think how over 1 million abortions could be for reasons of convenience.

"something that you do to make things easier for yourself or that is intended to make things easier for you"

http://www.macmillandictionary.com/dictionary/american/convenience

June 20, 2012 at noon
BigRidgePatriot said...

nucanuck said... "China is rapidly re-inventing herself and is moving ahead with thoughtful long-term planning. We have more to learn from China than to criticize."

This is the new liberal model to strive for. Sure, let's adopt China's model, along with the horrible labor compensation rates and wealth disparity that makes the US look like a socialist utopia. Do you really think that is something to strive towards?

I can imagine Chinese citizens are excited about the changes as many of them are in the right direction, unlike in our country. You have to consider their reference point though. An average US citizen placed into the place of the average Chinese citizen would probably consider suicide over the loss in standard of living.

June 20, 2012 at 12:24 p.m.
conservative said...

lightkeeper....

Your "Conservatives are such hypocrites, they say they don't want "big brother" telling them or people what to do, then want to shove big brother up a womens you know where" is such a strawman.

You propose a preposterous absolute that Conservatives hold to. I don't believe or demand what you accuse Conservative of and know of no other Conservative that does either. A society could not exist without laws which tell people what to do.

June 20, 2012 at 12:28 p.m.
Easy123 said...

Conservative,

Once again, you don't know whether any abortion is chosen because of convenience. That is an assumption on your part.

June 20, 2012 at 12:38 p.m.
Rickaroo said...

"This is not, in short, a government that is long on 'humanity.'" - editor

Ha! As if this editor or any of today's conservatives give a rat's ass about "humanity." The only way they want our government showing humanity is for the unborn - so much so that they think it's government's right to literally stick their nose into a woman's uterus. But the moment you come into this world, especially if you're born into poverty, you're considereed a drain on society and not worth spitting on. Their social-darwinist mindset will tell you to make it on your own or die. Period. If you don't share their fetish for God, guns, or money, you simply don't count. Or more accurately, you're considered an "unpatriotic" and hostile force.

A conservative expressing concern about government showing humanity? That's funny.

June 20, 2012 at 12:44 p.m.
conservative said...

easy....

Now, I warned you that I was setting you up. Over 1 million abortions are performed each year in this country for convenience. I gave you a definition of convenience - "something that you do to make things easier for yourself or that is intended to make things easier for you"

Here is a pro abortion website for you citing convenience reasons for abortions :

"The most common underlying reasons for abortion were 1) they could not afford a child at the time and were unmarried (42%), 2) it would interfere with their education (38%), 3) it would interfere with their employment (38%), and 4) they were students or planning to enroll in studies (34%). Other reasons are having relationship problems, not ready for another child, or don’t want people to know they had sex or got pregnant, the health of the fetus, victim of rape, or became pregnant as result of incest."

http://www.womenscenter.com/abortion_reasons.html

June 20, 2012 at 2:10 p.m.
Rickaroo said...

Con-man, let's assume that every one of those abortions had never been performed. That would be a million more human beings added to an already over-populated world. And since the overwhelming number of those babies would have been born into poverty, without a father, or into an environment where the mother would not have wanted that baby or been able to properly care for it, what would become of all those babies? There are already vastly more babies needing adoption than there are people willing or able to adopt them. And you say it's not government's role to be a "nanny state" and take care of them. So tell me, then, what would become of all those babies? That's a million of them...per year, according to your stats. If government has the power and authority to force a woman to give birth against her will, doesn't that same government have a responsiblity to care for that baby once it enters the world?

If you think it's not government's role to take take care of all those little cherubs you seem to care so much about, most of whom would be born into environments that breed crime and poverty, then I'm asking you....what would you suggest doing with them?

And don't tell me that it's not your responsiblity what to do with them. If you are advocating for an outlaw to all abortions, then you are taking away the woman's right to choose for herself, in which case you DO bear some responsibility in seeing how those babies are to be cared for. And if you say that there are some circumstances in which an abortion should be allowed, then it is not up to you to decide what is "convenience" and what is a matter of urgency and importance for that woman. Either way you look at it, you should either butt out or devise a way that a million unwanted babies per year added to our census can be fed, nurtured, and turned into healthy and productive members of society.

June 20, 2012 at 3:05 p.m.

China is an authoritarian government with a central hierarchy. This has been the case for the past few centuries.

The only thing that has changed is pretending to have the Mandate of the People instead of the Mandate of Heaven. But the reality is they're as close to people as they were to heaven.

June 20, 2012 at 3:11 p.m.
nucanuck said...

c-man seems to be an inadvertent proponent of a growing under-class.

June 20, 2012 at 3:18 p.m.
Easy123 said...

Conservative,

You have set me up for nothing. I never refuted your claim. I actually set you up to finally provide some evidence for your claim. Now that you have, I will refute your claim.

Having an abortion has little to do with convenience. Having an abortion likely didn't make these women's lives any "easier". Many likely finished school, sought higher education or got a job. Then, if they chose, had children later. It what way did having the abortion makes their lives "easier"? It would seem that it made them harder. If they had the child, they might have quit school or work. Then where would they be? Poverty or maybe worse?

You are mistaken. Abortion's are not done for "convenience". They are very hard decisions that take tremendous amounts of thought and examination. Convenience plays no part. Choosing education or a career over a child is not easier. Many of these women will likely live with the pain of their decision for the rest of their lives but, in the end, it was their decision and it should always be. You have no right to pass any judgment against these women. The choice is theirs and you have no right to say what any woman chooses to do with her own body.

June 20, 2012 at 3:20 p.m.
conservative said...

easy...

I provided you with the meaning of "convenience" and also provided you with a pro abortion cite giving the "convenient" reasons why the vast majority of women murder their unborn child.

"The most common underlying reasons for abortion were 1) they could not afford a child at the time and were unmarried (42%), 2) it would interfere with their education (38%), 3) it would interfere with their employment (38%), and 4) they were students or planning to enroll in studies (34%). Other reasons are having relationship problems, not ready for another child, or don’t want people to know they had sex or got pregnant, the health of the fetus, victim of rape, or became pregnant as result of incest."

http://www.womenscenter.com/abortion_reasons.html

As a professing Atheist you deny your creator and the creator of heaven and earth and mankind ; Psalm 14:1 The fool has said in his heart " there is no God" If a person can spread the greatest lie of all, the rest is easy.

It is certainly true - "it is folly to argue with a fool."

June 20, 2012 at 4:16 p.m.
Easy123 said...

Are you illiterate?

Those aren't reasons of convenience as I explained.

Prove there is any god, much less the Christian god. It is certainly true that you are gullible enough to believe something on no evidence. Religion is the greatest lie of all. It is the suspension of truth for superstition. You ignore reason and science and replace it with Iron Age barbarism. Congratulations!

June 20, 2012 at 4:27 p.m.
chatt_man said...

Easy, we'll be praying for you... because our God is a forgiving and welcoming God. Allah, the god I'm sure you would be quicker to take up for, will have his believers just hunt your ass down and kill you.

June 22, 2012 at 10:02 a.m.
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