published Sunday, April 28th, 2013

The Library & Museum

about Clay Bennett...

The son of a career army officer, Bennett led a nomadic life, attending ten different schools before graduating in 1980 from the University of North Alabama with degrees in Art and History. After brief stints as a staff artist at the Pittsburgh Post-Gazette and the Fayetteville (NC) Times, he went on to serve as the editorial cartoonist for the St. Petersburg Times (1981-1994) and The Christian Science Monitor (1997-2007), before joining the staff of the ...

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PlainTruth said...

For shame

April 28, 2013 at 12:28 a.m.
AndrewLohr said...

And there's a memorial for the 50,000,000+ US babies murdered for the convenience of grownups.

In rating Presidents, I rated President George W. Bush a "near failure" at http://voices.yahoo.com/ranking-presidents-usa-7505256.html.

But for an article comparing Presidents Bush and Obama and making clear that there's something to be said for Mr Bush in this regard, hit http://www.nationalreview.com/article/346355/reading-bush-years.

Unlike hate-filled narrow-minded liberals, we conservatives and fundamentalists know the people we disagree with are fellow humans mostly not devoid of good qualities, mostly able to notice points worth noticing, almost all able, by God's grace, to repent rather than perish. (Calvinism adds levels of understanding but this level is true for what it is.) "I beseech you in the bowels of Christ, think it possible that you may be mistaken"--Saint Oliver Cromwell the Great.

April 28, 2013 at 12:30 a.m.
John_Proctor said...

Winston Churchill described Andrew years ago.

"A fanatic is one who can't change his mind and won't change the subject."

No matter which little voice of the many he hears in his head, his reply is always the same.

April 28, 2013 at 12:35 a.m.
blackwater48 said...

FORGET EVERYTHING

Over time we tend to remember good times and forget the bad. It's a coping mechanism.

But with ex-President Pinhead, I've tried so hard to block out his screw ups I'm surprised when reality delivers another hot kiss at the end of wet fist.

Oh yeah, he invaded he wrong country. He cut taxes DURING A WAR. TWICE! Oh yeah, he charged the war on the nations' credit card. Oh yeah, he converted the biggest budget surplus in history into the biggest deficit. Oh yeah, and most of the time he talked like someone who had just been hit in the head with a shovel, so we all had to suffer that national embarrassment. Oh year, we got his unfunded MediCare part D, a sugarplum for the pharmaceutical industry costing taxpayers Billion$ every year. Oh yeah, and he blew through money like a crap through a goose, and by the time he left office Wall Street was tanking, GDP was SHRINKING 10 percent, and we were on the brink of complete and total economic collapse.

And the best thing HIS SUPPORTERS can muster to say about him is he's a likable fellow.

Part of a song I wrote about the Bush era goes like this:

"Lost it all nothing left to lose, I guess that's why god invented booze. So I drink and contemplate This Shakespeare tragedy/twist of fate..."

I like what republicans are peddling now: 'Bush kept us safe from terror attacks, unlike Obama.' Yeah, except for 9/11. Except for that, job well done. Otherwise, wasn't that a great play Mrs. Lincoln? But how was Bush to know terrorists were planning to attack? Well, there was the first bombing of the World Trade Center back in 1994, multiple bombings of Embassies overseas, the bombing on the U.S.S. Cole, etc., etc. Yeah, who could have predicted a domestic attack after learning, 'Bin Laden Determined to Strike Inside United Sates?

And the biggest irony? They built a presidential library for a clown who may have read 10 books in his entire life, including 'My Pet Goat.'

April 28, 2013 at 12:54 a.m.

Bush should be criticized for going along with Democrats too much on spending and on invading Iraq. Alas, he was unable to resist their hysteria. Whatever his faults, only a hateful dunce would compare his presidency to the Holocaust. The victims of Saddam Hussein’s genocide are, after all, among his biggest fans. Cheap and tacky once again, Mr. Bennett.

April 28, 2013 at 1:33 a.m.
alprova said...

WWWTW wrote: "Bush should be criticized for going along with Democrats too much on spending and on invading Iraq."

Could you be any more wrong? You're blaming Democrats for leading Bush to invade Iraq? I've read it all now.

Republicans dominated both Houses of Congress for all but the last two years GWB was in office. Discretionary spending went up 19% during his first term and a whopping 49% during his second term.

GWB, like Barack Obama, is not authorized to spend a dime. Congress has that authorization, and a President either signs spending bills or he doesn't. GWB never once vetoed a spending measure. So...he, like President Obama, when they sign on the dotted line, owns the responsibility for all the spending while he was in office.

GWB never saw a spending bill he didn't like during his entire time in office.

"Alas, he was unable to resist their hysteria."

Forgive me, but I am laughing at your hysteria and your faulty memory.

"Whatever his faults, only a hateful dunce would compare his presidency to the Holocaust."

Why don't you hop a plane, land in Iraq, hire an interpreter and query the locals as to how they feel about the United States and who they blame for the deaths of their loved ones?

How long do you believe it would be before you are sent home dead in a wooden box, if they returned your body at all?

"The victims of Saddam Hussein’s genocide are, after all, among his biggest fans."

Saddam Hussein was an evil man, and what he did was wrong, but so was the way we went in to take him out of his misery.

The victims of the actions by the United States Government, in ordering our military to shred that country to pieces, taking no less than 100,000 innocent lives in the process, has not gained us any allies in Iraq. None. We are just as vulnerable as we were when GWB/Cheney used faulty, misleading, and outright false intelligence to rally a nation to declare war.

"Cheap and tacky once again, Mr. Bennett."

Casualties of war is also considered genocide and if you don't believe it, ask any Iraqi who lost loved ones. The fact that it was unintentional does not excuse it one bit.

April 28, 2013 at 2:30 a.m.
lightkeeper said...

For one thing , the name of the museum is wrong, the name should be THE GEORGE W BUSH REPUBLICAN DISASTER BLAME IT ON THE DEMOCRATS PRESIDENTIAL MUSEUM

April 28, 2013 at 4:20 a.m.
EaTn said...

When the Iraq smoke finally settles and the head count is reliably complete, the Christians in this country will be shocked to learn of the tens of thousands Christians martyred there due to the failed Bush invasion.

April 28, 2013 at 6:33 a.m.
anniebelle said...

WWWTW, boy did you pick the right moniker, you are definitely what's wrong. Fortunately, there are more citizens that are not brainwashed who remember what happened exactly in the lead up to the invasion of a country that never did us any harm, and certainly not on 9/11. There are plenty of evil dictators in this world to eradicate, so why not North Korea next or Syria. Until we quit interfering in other countries battles, we will continue to pay in spades for our nefarious interventions. Just like with Hitler, we'll remember what these war criminals, bush/cheney, did to our country.

April 28, 2013 at 7:06 a.m.
joneses said...

This POS bennett will never speak of 75% of the American casualties in Afghanistan have occurred in the 4 plus years o'bastard has been in office. The foolish liberals will not hold o'bastard accountable for all the innocent civilians killed by o'bastard's drones. The mindless liberals will not hold o"bastard accountable for any of his lies. When o'bastard builds his library it will be so full of bull sh!t they will have to put in air pollution control devices just to accommodate the smell.

April 28, 2013 at 7:28 a.m.
conservative said...

But mine enemies are lively, and they are strong : and they that hate me wrongfully are multiplied .Psalm 38:19

April 28, 2013 at 7:39 a.m.
limric said...

Nice job Clay.

"The receptivity of the masses was very limited, their intelligence is small, but their power of forgetting is enormous."

"In consequence of these facts, all our propaganda was limited to a very few untruths and cheap slogans until the last members of Congress 'understood what we wanted them to understand"

[paraphrased from someone not only smarter than Bush - but even more psychopathic]

It is quite fitting though, don't you think?

April 28, 2013 at 7:51 a.m.
delmar said...

"the Hard Rock Cafe of catastrophic policy decisions" - Jon Stewart, classic

http://www.thedailyshow.com/full-episodes/thu-april-25-2013-vali-nasr

April 28, 2013 at 8:37 a.m.
conservative said...

Why do you boast in evil, O mighty man?

The lovingkindness of God endures all day long.

Your tongue devises destruction,

Like a sharp razor, O worker of deceit.

You love evil more than good,

Falsehood more than speaking what is right.

You love all words that devour,

O deceitful tongue.

But God will break you down forever;

He will snatch you up and tear you away from your tent, And uproot you from the land of the living.Psalm 52:1-5

April 28, 2013 at 8:42 a.m.
tifosi said...

This is liable to shock a few folks.

Saddam Hussein had to be stopped. Remember these pictures? http://hist073-iraqigenocide.wikispaces.com/

When he gassed the Kurds, it was time to stop him.

The Europeans waged war for centuries amongst themselves. Then democracy took root and America didn't have to send our young men to fight and die in Europe. President G.W. Bush planted the seeds of democracy on both sides of Iran. Perhaps someday historians will look back and say that is when the Middle East began to find peace. And, I won't have to send my grandkids or great-grandkids to fight and die for our energy needs. I believe President Bush's ultimate legacy has yet to be written.

April 28, 2013 at 8:46 a.m.
alprova said...

joneses, do you ever take notice that hardly anyone has much of an issue with the military efforts in Afghanistan?

Because that nation had been a harbinger of terrorism for decades. The Taliban were given an ultimatum to cough up Osama bin Laden or face the wrath of the United States. They ushered him out of the country.

But let's back up a little to when GWB was running for President in 1999, he began beating the war drums on the campaign trail and he targeted Saddam Hussein many times in those speeches.

On September 23, 1999, a little less than two years before 9/11, he stood in front of military college students at the Citadel, in South Carolina, and the text of that speech included some rather prophetic statements.

"Let me be clear. Our first line of defense is a simple message: Every group or nation must know, if they sponsor such attacks, our response will be devastating."

"Our military and our nation are entering another period of consequences – a time of rapid change and momentous choices."

"Now comes our time of testing. Our measure is taken, not only by what we have and use, but what we build and leave behind. And nothing this generation could ever build will matter more than the means to defend our nation and extend our peace."

In his 2002 State of the Union Speech, on January 29, 2002, while we were actively engaged in Afghanistan, he said;

"States like these [Iraq, Iran, and North Korea], and their terrorist allies, constitute an axis of evil, arming to threaten the peace of the world. By seeking weapons of mass destruction, these regimes pose a grave and growing danger. They could provide these arms to terrorists, giving them the means to match their hatred. They could attack our allies or attempt to blackmail the United States. In any of these cases, the price of indifference would be catastrophic."

And as we know, instead of ramping up the efforts in Afghanistan, key assets including intelligence operations and Special Forces units were pulled away from Afghanistan for the Iraq invasion that occurred on March 20, 2003.

Troop levels were very small in Afghanistan while massive numbers of troops were dropped into Iraq, and that remained so until Obama was elected.

On May 5, 2003, GWB uttered this gem;

"We found the weapons of mass destruction. We found biological laboratories. You remember when Colin Powell stood up in front of the world, and he said, Iraq has got laboratories, mobile labs to build biological weapons. They're illegal. They're against the United Nations resolutions, and we've so far discovered two. And we'll find more weapons as time goes on. But for those who say we haven't found the banned manufacturing devices or banned weapons, they're wrong, we found them."

(cont.)

April 28, 2013 at 8:53 a.m.
alprova said...

(cont.)

President Obama ended the war in Iraq. The war in Afghanistan now is on a time line to be ended. Osama bin Laden is dead. Are we any safer than we were in 2001?

I'd love for anyone to offer any evidence that we are.

We've won nothing. Nothing has been atoned or prevented. Hundreds of thousands of innocent people have died and their survivors are just as ticked off at the United States as those who died or still survive today.

April 28, 2013 at 8:53 a.m.
tifosi said...

Democracies were started.

April 28, 2013 at 8:59 a.m.
joneses said...

alprova,

Have you ever noticed what a liar you are? The date of the war ending in Iraq was established prior to o'bastard taking office. Stop being so blind and gullible to think o"bastard has done nothing wrong. O'bastard has lied more than any president ever and fools like you let him get away with it. Now my question is why are you and the rest of you mindless liberals not protesting the war in Afghanistan? Where is that b!tch Sandy Shehan? Do you not find it odd that as soon as o'bastard was elected she dropped off the face of the earth? Maybe she is in mourning with shawn penn and o"bastard about the communist dictator Hugo Chavez dying. Do you find it odd that 75% of American deaths in Afghanistan occurred in the 4.5 years o"bastard has been in office and they occurred in a war that o'bastard did not support? Where is your outrage about the innocent civilians being killed by o"bastard's drones you hypocritical POS? Where is your outrage you stupid SOB? when you can start being honest about o"bastard and his failure as a man and president you might have some credibility, until then take your lies and stick them up your liberal ass. I will not waste anymore time conversing with a pathetic fool like you as I have better things to do today moron.

April 28, 2013 at 9:04 a.m.
PlainTruth said...

With respect, whether the US left Afghanistan 8 yrs ago, or now, the results would be the same. Nothing will have changed. Except thousands of people would be alive today. GTF outta there right now.

April 28, 2013 at 9:15 a.m.
alprova said...

tifosi wrote: "This is liable to shock a few folks. Saddam Hussein had to be stopped. When he gassed the Kurds, it was time to stop him."

I agree wholeheartedly, but who dropped the ball on that one? Who was President when that happened? Ronald Reagan.

Why did it take 15 full years before Saddam Hussein was dealt with and removed?

Right, wrong, or indifferent, Saddam Hussein could have been taken out with one shot by a sniper team. But as we know, trillions of dollars would not have been funneled into the pockets of war profiteers for a decade, would they?

"President G.W. Bush planted the seeds of democracy on both sides of Iran. Perhaps someday historians will look back and say that is when the Middle East began to find peace."

Unfortunately, while seeds may have been planted, they are not taking root and it doesn't appear that they ever will. Iraq is just as unstable as it always has been and we are no longer welcome there...at all.

Afghanistan will destabilize just as quickly when we leave that nation too. Pakistan is the equivalent to our lovely state of Florida, a nice place for terrorists from all over the world to rest and relax.

"And, I won't have to send my grandkids or great-grandkids to fight and die for our energy needs."

It may not happen in any lifetime of those of us discussing this today, but unless the world starts making a notable shift to renewable sources of energy, and the world's supply of oil starts drying up, any and all wars of the past will look like playground fistfights.

"I believe President Bush's ultimate legacy has yet to be written."

I am firmly convinced that GWB's legacy has attained the highest level it will ever attain.

On January 12, 2009, he summed it up with the following;

""I'm telling you there's an enemy that would like to attack America...Americans...again. There just is. That's the reality of the world. And I wish him all the very best."

April 28, 2013 at 9:17 a.m.
MickeyRat said...

Where Tifosi?

April 28, 2013 at 9:21 a.m.
tifosi said...

Believe it or not, democracies do exist in Iraq and Afghanistan. They have had elections for the first time ever in their countries. Our nation's democracy was pretty feeble and ugly in the beginning. There were those that thought it was a dictatorship when President George Washington led the U.S. Army into Pittsburgh in order to enforce a tax on whiskey. They had just fought the Revolutionary War to stop taxation.

April 28, 2013 at 9:25 a.m.
joneses said...

Alpos

One more thing you are to stupid to acknowledge. President Bush was in office only, thanks to al gore, 5 months before 9/11. I do fault President Bush for relying on information left him by billary, "wheres the cigar" clinton who agreed on record as well as kerry, gore, pelosi and other foolish dummycrats that Saddam Hussein had WMDs. You conveniently left this fact out proving what a POS you really are.

April 28, 2013 at 9:32 a.m.
magenta said...

whats_wrong_with_the_world said... Bush should be criticized for going along with Democrats on invading Iraq

Bush came into office with the intent of invading Iraq. Remember him saying to his advisors: "Give me something ANYTHING to justify going into Iraq.

April 28, 2013 at 9:38 a.m.
alprova said...

joneses wrote: "alprova, Have you ever noticed what a liar you are? The date of the war ending in Iraq was established prior to o'bastard taking office."

You're only half right. Yes, there was the SOFA agreement signed just two months before GWB left office, but there was a list of contingencies and benchmarks that had to be met and he knew he was not going to be there to see to it that everything played out as was agreed to by both nations.

"Stop being so blind and gullible to think o"bastard has done nothing wrong."

Don't you think it's about time for you to stop being so blind and gullible to think that he has done nothing right?

"O'bastard has lied more than any president ever and fools like you let him get away with it."

Blah, blah, blah....blah, blah blah.

"Now my question is why are you and the rest of you mindless liberals not protesting the war in Afghanistan?"

Reading comprehension is not your strong point, is it?

"Where is that b!tch Sandy Shehan? Do you not find it odd that as soon as o'bastard was elected she dropped off the face of the earth?"

Casey Sheehan was killed in Iraq. To the best of my knowledge and research, not to mention like most people in this nation, Cindy Sheehan's entire protests surrounded the Iraqi war and she never once offered a word of protest about our military involvement in Afghanistan.

Try again.

"Do you find it odd that 75% of American deaths in Afghanistan occurred in the 4.5 years o"bastard has been in office and they occurred in a war that o'bastard did not support?"

And you call me a liar? Obama ran for President on a platform of ramping up the efforts in Afghanistan and he followed through with that promise after he was elected.

"Where is your outrage about the innocent civilians being killed by o"bastard's drones you hypocritical POS?"

Sir, drones have been used by our military for 30 years. Predator drones have been used as tools of warfare since 2001. The first strike by an armed drone occurred in Yemen in 2002. 43 countries own and operate unmanned drones. They are hardly an invention to be credited to our current President.

"Where is your outrage you stupid SOB?"

The real question that needs to be asked is why you, safe and sound in your armchair, typing your feeble thoughts day in and day out, have anything to be outraged about?

"when you can start being honest about o"bastard and his failure as a man and president you might have some credibility, until then take your lies and stick them up your liberal ass."

Naw...I'd rather keep pointing out how utterly silly you are.

"I will not waste anymore time conversing with a pathetic fool like you as I have better things to do today moron."

Gee...three weeks ago, you left and vowed to never return. That last what? Four days? I'm sure you'll get wound up again before the day is out, considering how credible you are and such...

April 28, 2013 at 10 a.m.
tifosi said...

Geez alprova and joneses... get a motel room.

April 28, 2013 at 10:09 a.m.
rick1 said...

Al said "Casey Sheehan was killed in Iraq. To the best of my knowledge and research, not to mention like most people in this nation, Cindy Sheehan's entire protests surrounded the Iraqi war and she never once offered a word of protest about our military involvement in Afghanistan."

Al, you did not look very hard if you could not find where Cindy Sheehan protested the war in Afghanistan.

http://www.democracynow.org/2010/3/19/cindy_sheehan_sets_up_camp_out

April 28, 2013 at 10:11 a.m.
dude_abides said...

An amusement park would have been more suitable to honor this ex President, with lots of pictures and hardly any words to read. Maybe the side walks could be pebbled with teeth. Are they really displaying that bull(sh!t)horn that he lied to us through?

April 28, 2013 at 10:15 a.m.
alprova said...

jones posted less than 30 minutes after declaring that he had better things to do: "Alpos, One more thing you are to stupid to acknowledge."

Oh no...if I'm so stupid, what makes you think you can reach me by beating your head against a wall?

"President Bush was in office only, thanks to al gore, 5 months before 9/11."

You were never proficient when doing simple arithmetic, were you?

January 20, 2001 to September 11, 2001 was nine days short of eight months in office.

"I do fault President Bush for relying on information left him by billary, "wheres the cigar" clinton who agreed on record as well as kerry, gore, pelosi and other foolish dummycrats that Saddam Hussein had WMDs."

I'm not about to get into some silly pissing contest with you over any of this. OF COURSE, Saddam Hussein had used WMD's within his own country. He used them in 1988, while Ronald Reagan was President. What did he do then?

But none were found in 2003, 15 years later, and you can pound your fist on a table all day long, but everyone knows who led the charge to invade Iraq on March 20, 2003 and what it was based upon.

It sure wasn't due to any statement by Clinton, Kerry, Pelosi, or any other Democrat you can name. George Walker Bush stood in front of Congress after passing out falsified intelligence reports that was manufactured to promote his desire to go after Saddam Hussein.

"You conveniently left this fact out proving what a POS you really are."

It's really hard to have any kind of an intelligent discussion with you. Your knowledge of the facts is astoundingly outweighed by your ignorance and your propensity to change verifiable and documented history.

April 28, 2013 at 10:23 a.m.
alprova said...

tifosi wrote: "Geez alprova and joneses... get a motel room."

You're rather new here or you are someone who has changed their nic to play some new games.

Either way, your only choice is to read what you want to read or not read what is posted.

Comments like that are not going to endear yourself to anyone or get you laid tonight, so I fail to understand why you would even offer it.

April 28, 2013 at 10:31 a.m.
PlainTruth said...

Health Care Politics: As ObamaCare rolls out, some of its biggest backers from labor to D.C. lawmakers are having second thoughts. It's a sign that the idea of ending this national nightmare isn't about to go away. Late last week, the 22,000-member United Union of Roofers, Waterproofers and Allied Workers dropped a bombshell on the Obama administration, not only withdrawing its support for the Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act, but also demanding its repeal. the worm is beginning to turn

April 28, 2013 at 10:45 a.m.
alprova said...

patriot1 wrote: "Al, you did not look very hard if you could not find where Cindy Sheehan protested the war in Afghanistan."

Okay, I stand corrected. She apparently did come to include Afghanistan as well.

Cindy Sheehan lost her son. She had every right to feel the way she did. I find it totally deplorable that she was vilified the way she was by anyone and everyone who beat a war drum from the confines of their armchairs.

I'm going to write the following and then let it drop...Please feel free to attempt to offer the display of testosterone of your choosing.

I'd bet both my right and left arms that not one of you people who has a damn thing negative to say about Cindy Sheehan has ever been in combat and/or has lost a loved one as a result of combat.

And you can all go screw yourself until you scream out the Lord's name in orgasmic frenzy, lay exhausted on the bed, and have extinguished your celebratory cigarette.

Your opinions on the matter are highly irrelevant and they always have been.

April 28, 2013 at 10:46 a.m.
patriot1 said...

Alpo says...I'd bet both my right and left arms that not one of you people who has a damn thing negative to say about Cindy Sheehan has ever been in combat and/or has lost a loved one as a result of combat.

Yes, I have been critical of Sheehan and have served in combat..so let the amputations begin. If you have not been there, done that, or been afflicted by it, you have a family member that has....please spare us.

April 28, 2013 at 11:05 a.m.
rick1 said...

Al, get off your high horse and be honest, the liberal news media used Cindy Sheehan while Bush was in office. The minute Bush left office the same liberal media kicked Sheehan to the curb like a piece of trash.

Of course you will not question the motives of the liberal media you love so much because it fit your agenda also.

You are shameless.

April 28, 2013 at 11:13 a.m.
tifosi said...

alprova wrote:

"Comments like that are not going to endear yourself to anyone or get you laid tonight, so I fail to understand why you would even offer it."

And the diatribes between you and joneses brings what level of intelligence to the conversation??? You seem like you should have a level of intelligence that is above what you are doing. Instead you grovel in the mud with joneses.

"Your opinions on the matter are highly irrelevant and they always have been."

Yet you respond.

April 28, 2013 at 11:16 a.m.
alprova said...

patriot1 wrote: "Yes, I have been critical of Sheehan and have served in combat..so let the amputations begin. If you have not been there, done that, or been afflicted by it, you have a family member that has....please spare us."

I'm surprised, given that you seem to stalk every word I type, that you do not know that I have indeed lost loved ones in combat.

I've posted that fact many times.

April 28, 2013 at 11:37 a.m.
tifosi said...

For whatever it is worth. I am former 2nd Armored Cavalry, a very distinguished unit that I am proud to have been a part of. Look it up. My father was 3rd Marine Division in the South Pacific and I am incredibly proud of his service. My great grandfather fought in the Spanish American War. The funny thing is, I have never owned a gun. Never seen a need to either. There are no serious threats here.

"No one hates war more than a soldier" - Dwight D. Eisenhower

April 28, 2013 at 11:40 a.m.
rick1 said...

Al, as much as you want to believe that patriot1 and myself are the same person, we are not.

April 28, 2013 at 11:42 a.m.
alprova said...

tifosi wrote: "And the diatribes between you and joneses brings what level of intelligence to the conversation??? You seem like you should have a level of intelligence that is above what you are doing. Instead you grovel in the mud with joneses"

The only time I crank up against joneses, is when he is guilty of passing on outrageous examples of misinformation.

His opinions are meaningless. But today, he attempted to be factual, and when those facts are incorrect, he deserves to be called on the carpet for them.

You would serve yourself best to stay on the sidelines when people have occasional spats between themselves.

Or, you can continue to post whatever you want and find it ignored.

April 28, 2013 at 11:43 a.m.
alprova said...

Pardon me rick1, but I was totally unaware that Cindy Sheehan was still camped out in Crawford, Texas, and that the media simply wasn't covering it any longer, now that Obama is in the House.

April 28, 2013 at 11:44 a.m.
tifosi said...

And yet you respond. Get out of the mud. You are better than that.

April 28, 2013 at 11:45 a.m.
alprova said...

rick1 wrote: "Al, as much as you want to believe that patriot1 and myself are the same person, we are not."

Sorry 'bout that. You both have "1" following your names and I sometimes glance and only see the "1"....

April 28, 2013 at 11:47 a.m.
mountainlaurel said...

Clay Bennett notes: "It makes sense. . . After all, there's a Holocaust museum."

Good job, Clay Bennett. . . It’s much easier to heal and move forward when wrongs are openly acknowledged. . Unfortunately, this is something the average U.S. politician has trouble doing.

April 28, 2013 at 11:51 a.m.
patriot1 said...

alpo says..."I'm surprised, given that you seem to stalk every word I type...."

Get over yourself alpo...I don't have the time or desire to read all the tomes you compose on here, neither do I care to read about all your family history. I can just see through you easier than you can see out of the windows of that double wide.

April 28, 2013 at 12:07 p.m.
Jt6gR3hM said...

blackwater48 said...

Part of a song I wrote about the Bush era goes like this:

"Lost it all nothing left to lose, I guess that's why god invented booze. So I drink and contemplate This Shakespeare (sic) tragedy/twist of fate..."


How sweet, you wrote a song about President Bush. It was heart rending in its raw emotions of personal loss and the resultant degradation of sinking into drug abuse to mask the pain.

There is only one problem. Where is the obligatory mention of your mother being run over by a freight train as she walks in the pouring rain to visit you in the state prison for killing your two timing wife for her affair with the chairman of the county Republican party.


By the way, President Obama for all of his faults is a very likeable fellow. Maybe you can find time to write a nice song for him but you can of course forget the part about his mother.

April 28, 2013 at 12:11 p.m.

The control of Congress is, indeed, key for assessing responsibility for bloated government spending. Bush should be criticized for going along with Democrats too much on spending.

http://www.forbes.com/sites/chrisconover/2013/01/31/are-republican-bigger-spenders-than-democrats/

http://www.humanevents.com/2013/04/11/our-government-spending-problem/

http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/features/2006/0603.drum.html

Democrats excoriated Bush’s father for not invading Iraq and, for the next 15 years, argued that it was the right thing to do. The entire National Security team of the Clinton administration supported Bush’s decision to invade Iraq. Bush should be criticized for going along with Democrats too much on invading Iraq.

http://www.discoverthenetworks.org/viewSubCategory.asp?id=23

Whatever his faults, only a hateful dunce would compare his presidency to the Holocaust. The victims of Saddam Hussein’s genocide are, after all, among his biggest fans.

“It's been ten years since the U.S.-led invasion, and most will observe the anniversary by remembering the dead and evaluating mistakes. Things are a little different in Iraqi Kurdistan, the northernmost autonomous region where the "invasion" is still referred to -- insistently -- as a "liberation." “The Iraq War Was a Good Idea, If You Ask the Kurds: They love George W. Bush for liberating them, but their region's relative stability might not last” by Jenna Krajeski (The Atlantic, March 20 2013) http://www.theatlantic.com/international/archive/2013/03/the-iraq-war-was-a-good-idea-if-you-ask-the-kurds/274196/

The Holocaust? Really? Bennett will stop at nothing to affirm liberals in their fantasy that George W. Bush pulled the idea of invading Iraq out of thin air. Cheap and tacky once again, Mr. Bennett.

April 28, 2013 at 12:14 p.m.
alprova said...

patriot1 wrote: "Get over yourself alpo...I don't have the time or desire to read all the tomes you compose on here, neither do I care to read about all your family history. I can just see through you easier than you can see out of the windows of that double wide."

You've proven that you don't care...repeatedly...NOT, and very much like some other people who frequent this forum, you are simply a legend in your own mind.

Oh...and by the way, my home was not pre-manufactured. It was built, board by board, shingle by shingle, right where it stands today, 17 years ago. I have no mortgage to pay and with my homestead exemption, my property taxes are dirt cheap.

April 28, 2013 at 12:25 p.m.
mountainlaurel said...

Tifosi says: “President G.W. Bush planted the seeds of democracy on both sides of Iran. Perhaps someday historians will look back and say that is when the Middle East began to find peace. And, I won't have to send my grandkids or great-grandkids to fight and die for our energy needs.”

And what kind of seeds do you think President George W. Bush planted for your kids, grandkids and great-grandkids here at home in the U.S.? You can hardly refer to President Bush's contributions as “seeds of democracy” - torture, rendition, the Patriot Acts, wireless wiretapping, the abrogation of habeas corpus, Abu Ghraib, and Guantanamo.

April 28, 2013 at 12:32 p.m.
timbo said...

This was an easy one for me. Bush was a big spending, terrible president but a nice guy. Obama is a big spending, worse president and he is not a nice guy. Obama is an arrogant ass.

This fantasy that things would've been better if someone like Obama had been president during Bush's term is lunacy. By the way, I knew Bill Clinton, and Obama is no Clinton. The way Obama spends money we would've Already been in a depression. I think Bush's mistakes were basically honest. Tried to help the American people but he was just wrong. Obama,on the other hand, is furthering some philosophical agenda to promote Socialism and tear down the things that make this country great.

If we don't make a sharp right turn in this country, Obama will go down in history as the beginning of the End.

Does that no talent, left wing hack, Bennett know anything except to insult the other side?

April 28, 2013 at 12:50 p.m.
PlainTruth said...

"You want to talk about US troops in Syria? Fine. Call me after Turkey commits a 100,000 or so troops to the cause."

April 28, 2013 at 12:51 p.m.
PlainTruth said...

"Government, journalism, entertainment: 3 industries who hold their customers in utter contempt." -David Burge

April 28, 2013 at 12:54 p.m.
blackwater48 said...

SING IT LOUD

Jt6gR3hM responded to my earlier post by mistaking the phrase 'Bush era' to mean I wrote a song about President Pinhead. I didn't. It is actually called, 'The Ballad of Bernie Madoff,' and my friends get a kick out of it. Even my arch-conservative ones because they lost money, too. The song is NOT autobiographical.

I never invested with Madoff or anyone else. I like doing my own homework when my own money is on the line. I found it odd that you made the leap to this conclusion:

"Where is the obligatory mention of your mother being run over by a freight train as she walks in the pouring rain to visit you in the state prison for killing your two timing wife for her affair with the chairman of the county Republican party."

Now THAT sounds autobiographical.

Sing it loud.

April 28, 2013 at 1:19 p.m.
mosquito said...

Another great toon from The Clay Pigeon!! but I wonder if he will afford the same courtesy to the Big O after his time in office..

April 28, 2013 at 1:20 p.m.
blackwater48 said...

TIME TO FEED THE TROLL... AGAIN

Timbo continues down the road of the factually deprived. He blathered, "The way Obama spends money we would've Already been in a depression. I think Bush's mistakes were basically honest."

Gosh, that's enough manure for the entire spring crop.

The Wall Street Journal, that bastion of fascist, socialist, and liberal thinking, reported that the Deficit has been shrinking A LOT even before sequestration kicks in.

Bush cherry picked intel to justify the Iraq invasion. That's not honesty. That's DIShonesty. He skewed the facts to justify his conclusion.

I don't care about your opinions, but I agree with Al: when you lie, somebody has to whack you.

Consider yourself whacked, you little Troll.

April 28, 2013 at 1:32 p.m.
BigRidgePatriot said...

Oh Lord help us! If there is any comparison to the Holocaust it would be what the Obama administration (and all progressives, democrat and republican) are doing to this (once) great nation.

April 28, 2013 at 1:51 p.m.
mosquito said...

Right on Blackwater48, but I humbly think it's deeper than that. O has some intelligence while W (and a large part of the country)was being led around by the nose. And one wonders why Colin Powell came out for O ?? What would you do if you had been put up in front of the U.N. with blatantly bogus intel ? WMD's my ass..........but wait!!

We are now seeing the makings of the sequel in Syria..stay tuned

April 28, 2013 at 1:59 p.m.
mountainlaurel said...

Magenta notes: “Bush came into office with the intent of invading Iraq. Remember him saying to his advisors: "Give me something ANYTHING to justify going into Iraq.”

Yes, I remember this. Former Secretary of Treasury, Paul O’Neill, was one of the advisors, but Bush fired him. O’Neill dared to disagree with Dick Cheney’s belief that “deficits don’t matter.” He also dared to question the "war on terror" and expressed his concerns that the invasion of Iraq was simply an excuse for a war that had been decided long ago by the neo cons.

April 28, 2013 at 2:36 p.m.
PlainTruth said...

Live Action has come out with another undercover video that will just leave you in disbelief to hear this staff worker at Dr. Emily Women’s Health Center, an abortion clinic in Bronx, New York, describe the abortion process to this young woman for her baby at 23 weeks, just one week away from abortion being illegal in New York. At one point the staff worker even suggests that if the baby pops out at home, which she says has never happened, to just ‘flush it’ down the toilet. sounds about right

April 28, 2013 at 3:02 p.m.
tifosi said...

mountainlaurel said:

"And what kind of seeds do you think President George W. Bush planted for your kids, grandkids and great-grandkids here at home in the U.S.? You can hardly refer to President Bush's contributions as “seeds of democracy” - torture, rendition, the Patriot Acts, wireless wiretapping, the abrogation of habeas corpus, Abu Ghraib, and Guantanamo."

ALL presidents have skirted the rules. Considering what was at stake I think it was appropriate. John McCain knows what torture is. What the U.S. did was not even close. Unpleasant? yes. Torture? no. Not one of the items you described have ever been successfully challenged in front of SCOTUS. They are the ones that decide what is legal. Not you.

Abu Grahib was dealt with... not to my satisfaction. Abrogation of habeus corpus was dealt with and the representatives of the American people disagreed with you. http://www.fas.org/irp/congress/2007_cr/s185.html

If you truly believe you are right, then I suggest you get up from behind your keyboard and press the issue through proper channels.

"rendition"???

April 28, 2013 at 3:26 p.m.
kellie2479 said...

What a mean and leftist cartoon. That is so unfair. Obama and the left took cheap shots at Bush, then did everything he did and more. And bragged about getting Bin Laden, evn thought water boarding is how they found him. For shame is right.

April 28, 2013 at 3:40 p.m.
Easy123 said...

kellie2479,

"Obama and the left took cheap shots at Bush, then did everything he did and more."

Mostly false.

"And bragged about getting Bin Laden, evn thought water boarding is how they found him."

And you WingNuts turn getting Bin Laden into a negative when you're the same warmongers that were asking for his head on a stick when G. W. Bush was President. It's not this administrations fault that they had better "seek" tactics than the previous administration.

"For shame is right."

It's a shame that WingNuts like yourself have such a skewed, misguided view of history and reality. That WingNut propaganda really works.

April 28, 2013 at 3:51 p.m.
riverman said...

Just for the record George Tenet, CIA Director who was appointed by Clinton and retained by Bush ,slammed his fist on Bush's desk and said it was a slam dunk that Iraq had WMDs. And also just for the record if I had lost relatives in the Holocaust I would come down their and kick Clay's White Trash wimpy ass all the way back to Alabama where it belongs.

April 28, 2013 at 4:04 p.m.
tifosi said...

kellie2479 said: What a mean and leftist cartoon. That is so unfair.

I agree. I ususally like Clay's perspective, but this one minimalizes the horror of the Holocaust that Jews and others faced. It hurts Clay's credibility. The Pulitzer would be unimpressed.

April 28, 2013 at 4:06 p.m.
Easy123 said...

riverman,

"if I had lost relatives in the Holocaust I would come down their and kick Clay's White Trash wimpy ass all the way back to Alabama where it belongs."

And if you had lost relatives in Iraq and/or Afghanistan? Would you come down their (sic) and kick George's White Trash wimpy ass all the way back to Texas where it belongs?

April 28, 2013 at 4:07 p.m.
Silverengine3 said...

I'll make this brief and without personal opinion, even though I have strong ones as it relates to the bush legacy. I've personally read and studied a lot on this topic and invite anyone else to do their own research. The real bush family legacy goes back to Prescott Bush. This family has been involved in many dirty dealings, and admittedly, some good things as well. But the biggest event perhaps in our history that george hw bush was directly involved in was President John Kennedy's assassination. This event helped to propel his political career. Feel free to do your own research on this.

April 28, 2013 at 4:09 p.m.
Easy123 said...

tifosi,

"but this one minimalizes the horror of the Holocaust that Jews and others faced."

How so? How does drawing a parallel between unnecessary murder/death in Iraq/Afghanistan "minimalize" (sic) unnecessary murder/death in the concentration camps? Aren't they both egregiously terrible crimes against the people affected or are the murders/deaths in Iraq and Afghanistan less terrible than those in the Holocaust?

April 28, 2013 at 4:11 p.m.
tifosi said...

Easy123: I guess you do not subscribe to the U.S. Constitution and how it works. What happened in Iraq and Afghanistan were acts of war declared by the American people under the U.S. Constitution. If you feel that the USC was violated, then get up from behind your keyboard and do something besides whining here.

I cannot possibly see how anyone with a rationale mind can compare the two. The Hague does not agree with you.

April 28, 2013 at 4:16 p.m.
Easy123 said...

tifosi,

"I guess you do not subscribe to the U.S. Constitution and how it works. What happened in Iraq and Afghanistan were acts of war declared by the American people under the U.S. Constitution."

Based on outright lies and false information from historically unreliable sources. Anyone can hide behind the Constitution. Much like the WingNuts hide behind the Second Amendment. Simply because those American wars were started "legally" doesn't mean they were right or moral.

"If you feel that the USC was violated, then get up from behind your keyboard and do something besides whining here."

I'm not the one whining. You're the one bitching about a cartoon. I'm stating facts. I can't change what happened, but I can voice my opinion on the facts of the story instead of completely ignoring them and hiding behind the Constitution as you have.

"I cannot possibly see how anyone with a rationale mind can compare the two. The Hague does not agree with you."

So you believe that the murders/deaths among civilians and soldiers in Iraq and Afghanistan were "less bad" than those in the Holocaust? I guess being bombed in your own home is much better than being gassed to death, right? There are plenty of parallels. You're just too blind to see them. Here is one example of the horror:

April 28, 2013 at 4:18 p.m.
mountainlaurel said...

Tifosi says: “Not one of the items you described have ever been successfully challenged in front of SCOTUS. They are the ones that decide what is legal. Not you.”

Interesting response coming from someone prattling on about planting “*seeds of democracy” for his kids, grandkids and great-grandkids. From my perspective, torture, the Patriot Acts, wireless wiretapping, the abrogation of habeas corpus, Abu Ghraib, and Guantanamo are not healthy seeds for a President to plant in a democracy - and it’s certainly not something that America can be proud to pass along to future generations.

Tifosi says: “Considering what was at stake I think it was appropriate. John McCain knows what torture is. What the U.S. did was not even close. Unpleasant? yes. Torture? no.

For the record, I believe John McCain has stated on numerous occasions that he does not condone torture and that waterboarding and other "torture lite" techniques do, in fact, constitute torture. Needless to say, John McCain is not the only one with this view. Indeed, I just read about a recent task force report that came to the same conclusion:

“It was torture,” The Constitution Project's independent, bipartisan, blue-ribbon Task Force on Detainee Treatment concluded in a report released April 16, 2013.”

http://detaineetaskforce.org/

April 28, 2013 at 5:05 p.m.
tifosi said...

Those involved in the Mahmudiyah killings and rape are facing a military tribunal, as they should be.

America spends billions of dollars every year to develop new technologies to minimalize the loss of innocent lives. That is why we have laser guided ammunitions and they work incredibly well.

EASY123, you are a benefactor of the killing of millions by way of carpet bombing, fire bombings and the atomic bombs. You enjoy the freedom brought by annihilation of Japanese and German civilians that worked in the war machines (industry). By remaining in this country you are complicit in these crimes and now you have the burden of the violence bestowed on others.

I have actually defended you when conservative and Maximus were in attack mode, but now I see just how absurd you are. You are just as extreme as they are. You have lost ability use objectivity in learning and understanding the world. There are people that want to kill you.

April 28, 2013 at 5:09 p.m.
tifosi said...

I have said my piece about this cartoon. I agree with 99% of Clay's work. I never voted for President G.W. Bush. I voted for President Obama twice. I definitely cannot be labeled as a Republican/conservative. This cartoon minimalizes the deliberate and heinous murder of 6 million Jews at the hands of the Nazis. Any comparison is absurd and a disgrace to all the other work that Clay has done. He does not deserve a Pulitzer and should spend a little time with Mira Kimmelman in Oak Ridge explaining his rationale.

Good day.

April 28, 2013 at 5:25 p.m.
alprova said...

For what it's worth Mountainlaural, I am sure that despite any statement by any of our leaders that torture is wrong, it has been practiced by many red-blooded Americans since this nation has existed.

There have been rumors to the effect since I have lived on this Earth and I'm sure nothing has changed.

April 28, 2013 at 5:34 p.m.
alprova said...

tifosi wrote: "I ususally like Clay's perspective, but this one minimalizes the horror of the Holocaust that Jews and others faced."

Since I doubt that you have lived in anyplace on Earth where war is a daily occurrence, where you might be targeted for death simply because you hold alternative religious or political beliefs, or maybe because it might be that you prefer the company of someone your own gender, I find it difficult to imagine that you have an inkling what some people experience that is indeed quite comparable to what the Jews experienced during the Holocaust.

Genocide is just as wrong and abhorrent whether it's purposely ordered by the leader of sovereign nation on a quest to rule the world, or a happenstance of war ordered by a President of the United States on a quest to bring Democracy to regions of the world who may not have ever experienced it.

The innocent who die are no more or less dead, regardless of what led up to their demise. Those who are still alive are just as grateful to be alive, to at the very least have a chance to piece their broken lives back together.

You might not agree with the contrast, but if all people were to agree on everything, conversations would be rather boring, don't you think?

April 28, 2013 at 5:50 p.m.
alprova said...

tofosi wrote: "What happened in Iraq and Afghanistan were acts of war declared by the American people under the U.S. Constitution."

You might want to amend that just a little bit. The "American people" did not declare a thing. It most certainly was not put to a vote, with each and every American having their say on the matter.

No, it was our appointed leaders, without consulting a soul, who voted in numbers high enough, offering their support of the President to engage our military in combat.

"If you feel that the USC was violated, then get up from behind your keyboard and do something besides whining here."

Not that the comment was directed at myself, I understand fully that as a peon, there is little that I, you, or anyone else can do to prevent our nation's leaders from honoring or trashing the United States Constitution.

"I cannot possibly see how anyone with a rationale mind can compare the two. The Hague does not agree with you."

Oh brother....

April 28, 2013 at 5:59 p.m.
riverman said...

Hey Easy, what about LBJ and the 58,000 young Americans who gave their lives for a war that LBJ and Strange McNamara later said we didn't have a chance of winning? You want to compare Vietnam to Afghanistan? Did the Viet Cong or North Vietnamese ever fly airplanes into buildings into NY and Washington? Iraq I agree was a mistake, but as I posted earlier the Director of the CIA told Bush it was a slam dunk that Saddam had WMDs. I dont blame Tenet, I think he honestly thought Saddam did. JMHO

April 28, 2013 at 6:15 p.m.
PlainTruth said...

"I don't regret setting bombs. I feel we didn't do enough.'' Dzhokhar Tsarnaev, wait, my bad, that was #Obama's friend #BillAyres"

April 28, 2013 at 6:16 p.m.
alprova said...

Timbo wrote: "Does that no talent, left wing hack, Bennett know anything except to insult the other side?"

Have you ever met a Democrat or a Liberal that you never felt the need to insult?

April 28, 2013 at 6:29 p.m.
jjmez said...

riverman said... Did the Viet Cong or North Vietnamese ever fly airplanes into buildings into NY and Washington?

Neither did any Iraqis or Afghanis fly airplanes into NY and Washington buildings. So why invade them? According to USATODAY article dated 02/06/2002, 15 of the 19 allege highjackers were Saudi citizens. The remainder four were both Jordanian and Egyptian. Yet even later, many of those named and allegedly involved in the 9/11 attacks were found to be alive and well in their native countries. hmmmmmmm

April 28, 2013 at 6:51 p.m.
jjmez said...

wwwtw said... The victims of Saddam Hussein’s genocide are, after all, among his biggest fans.

So the Bush invades and committs an even greater genocide than Hussein's, but you're alright with that? Where's the proof that Hussein committed genocide? There is none. Right up there with WMD. Plus, every weapon Hussein had, even chemical, were provided to him by his American allies. Remember the U.S. soldier who happened upon a cache of weapons right after the invasion of Iraq stating they were all stamped "Made in America?"

April 28, 2013 at 6:56 p.m.
Easy123 said...

tifosi,

"Those involved in the Mahmudiyah killings and rape are facing a military tribunal, as they should be."

Only after the entire crime was covered up.

"America spends billions of dollars every year to develop new technologies to minimalize the loss of innocent lives. That is why we have laser guided ammunitions and they work incredibly well."

Yet America still sends young people to die for it's lies and hundreds of thousands of innocent lies are lost.

"EASY123, you are a benefactor of the killing of millions by way of carpet bombing, fire bombings and the atomic bombs. You enjoy the freedom brought by annihilation of Japanese and German civilians that worked in the war machines (industry)."

And millions of other atrocities that have been perpetrated by the American government against others. It's truly shameful.

"By remaining in this country you are complicit in these crimes and now you have the burden of the violence bestowed on others."

I am complicit in none of those crimes nor do I bear the burden of that violence.

"I have actually defended you when conservative and Maximus were in attack mode, but now I see just how absurd you are."

It is you that is absurd. I simply view the facts for what they are. You like to sugar-coat them and rationalize war/murder to yourself in the name of "America". I cannot do that. No Iraqi civilians ever did any harm to me or my family. I can say that for any number of countries that we have gone to war with over the years.

"You are just as extreme as they are."

Look in the mirror.

"You have lost ability use objectivity in learning and understanding the world."

I'm not the one trying to rationalize murder and going to war based on lies.

"There are people that want to kill you."

That type of thinking is what G. W. Bush used to scare others into going along with his lies. There are people that hate America and others willing to blow themselves up to kill Americans, but those people are a very minuscule portion of our world. I am not willing to risk murdering hundreds of thousands of innocent people because there are people in the world that hate Americans. I do not wish for anyone else to die for MY freedom.

April 28, 2013 at 7:16 p.m.
jjmez said...

tifosi said... Any comparison is absurd and a disgrace to all the other work that Clay has done.

Comparisons are quite accurate. Not to minimize the Holocaust. Any mass killings at the hands of leaders in supposedly civilized society are tragic. But since you want to play with numbers, you should be enlightened: Hitler didn't just target all Jews, at least not at the beginning. Some rose to high ranks and were awarded prestigious military medals for their military service. It was a certain ethnic Jew he went after. More likely Mediterraneans who were darker in complexion. Remember, Hitler did have Jews in his military. See book: "Hitler's Jewish Soldiers" by Bryan Rigg. Hitler also targeted Gypsies, the small population of Africans living in Germany and married to German women at the time, the frail, ill, disabled. etc. That said however, in a 12 year period from 1933-1945 it is estimated over 6 million Jews were killed, compared to within a 4 year period there were an estimated 30 million Rurssians killed.

It is always amazingly tragic just how little Americans not only don't know about World History, but even less about their own American History.

April 28, 2013 at 7:16 p.m.
mosquito said...

yes indeedy jjmez, saudi's are lot's o places...911 all the way to the Boston bombings..not sure who's running whom but I read many years back that the U.S. made agreements that would price oil in U.S.dollars after we were completely neutered from the gold standard. And the Saudi's gots alotta dat don't they

April 28, 2013 at 7:18 p.m.
Easy123 said...

PlainTruth,

"that was #Obama's friend #BillAyres"

President Obama and Bill Ayers are not "friends" per se. The two only knew each other in passing.

April 28, 2013 at 7:25 p.m.
delmar said...

tifosi said... "What the U.S. did was not even close. Unpleasant? yes. Torture? no."

tell that to Dilawar - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dilawar_...

April 28, 2013 at 7:26 p.m.
degage said...

Delmar, went to your link and it came up Bad title.

April 28, 2013 at 7:39 p.m.
Easy123 said...

If I can find delmar's link, then I think you could as well if you took a little initiative.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dilawar_(torture_victim)

April 28, 2013 at 7:49 p.m.
degage said...

After I typed that I went to search engine and typed in Dilawar and found it.

April 28, 2013 at 7:59 p.m.
mountainlaurel said...

Alprova notes: “I am sure that despite any statement by any of our leaders that torture is wrong, it has been practiced by many red-blooded Americans since this nation has existed. There have been rumors to the effect since I have lived on this Earth and I'm sure nothing has changed.”

I don’t quite understand your point here, Alprova. What you say may very well be true, but the reason these anit-torture rules and guidelines were established by the Geneva Conventions was to try to hold nations accountable and to try to assure that prisoners of war and/or people who fall into enemy hands would be treated in a humane way.

Former Secretary of State Colin L. Powell certainly understood the advantages of applying the rules of the Geneva Convention and didn’t hesitate to let it be known that he felt declaring the conventions inapplicable would "reverse over a century of U.S. policy and practice in supporting the Geneva Conventions and undermine the protections of the laws of war for our troops."

April 28, 2013 at 7:59 p.m.
jjmez said...

tifosi said... "What the U.S. did was not even close. Unpleasant? yes. Torture? no."

Not according to American military, tifosi. They're findings concluded America did torture, over 95% of those tortured had nothing to do with terrorist, terrorism or insurgencies before they were tortured. Can't say for sure how many who survived being tortured turned terrorists and insurgents afterwards.

April 28, 2013 at 8:01 p.m.
degage said...

jjmez, What is your proof?

April 28, 2013 at 8:08 p.m.
jjmez said...

Military Investigation, DOJ, DOD findings. Although the report was quickly downplayed and hidden.

In one such interrogation, an interrogator (likely more unknowns), after watching a suspected terrorist/insurgent being interrogated, went back to their room immediately afterwards and committed suicide. Couldn't live with whatever it was they'd just witnessed.

April 28, 2013 at 8:42 p.m.
Rickaroo said...

"This cartoon minimalizes the deliberate and heinous murder of 6 million Jews at the hands of the Nazis. Any comparison is absurd and a disgrace to all the other work that Clay has done." - tifosi

In Iraq alone, there have been hundreds of thousands (some estimates are over a million) innocent inhabitants killed as collateral damage from the war. Millions more have been displaced from their homes. Over 5000 U.S soldiers have lost their lives in that war and many thousands more are permanently maimed and emotionally scarred. If you think all the death and carnage were worth the attempt to find those fictitious WMDs and/or to "spread democracy," then you are a fool, there's no other way to put it. And if you think that any form of democracy will take hold there as a result of that war, you are an even greater fool. In both Afghanistan and Iraq dictatorships of some form will re-emerge just as soon as we are completely gone from there. They are a people steeped in religious tribalism and cannot relate to western democracy in any form.

The evidence is abundant that Bush and his neo-con cronies cherry-picked intelligence and lied outright to make his case for WMDs in Iraq and it was only after it was obvious that there were none to be found that he then tried to make the case for "deposing a tyrant" and for "spreading democracy." It is not much of a stretch to compare the blood on Bush's hands to that on the hands of Hitler. The guy is a war criminal and needs to be brought to justice. Instead he's enjoying retirement, rewriting history in his memoirs and making hundreds of thousands of dollars in speaking engagements. Maybe Bush is not quite in the same league with Hitler but he's a despicable, soul-less bastard in his own right and deserves to spend the rest of his life behind bars, at the very least.

April 28, 2013 at 8:49 p.m.
degage said...

So no proof.

April 28, 2013 at 8:50 p.m.
Rickaroo said...

"You have lost ability use objectivity in learning and understanding the world. There are people that want to kill you." - tifosi

I think we all agree that there are terrorists who want to kill us. But that does not justify declaring all-out war or dropping bombs. We would do much better to spend our money, time, and resources making our nation stronger and better internally than going off half-cocked in various countries, where we are only creating more enemies and killing innocent people in the cross-fire. You people who readily justify war and torture are the ones who lack objectivity. You react on raw emotion, waving the flag and thinking that American might always makes right. You can't get any less objective than that.

April 28, 2013 at 9:14 p.m.
alprova said...

Mountainlaurel wrote: "I don’t quite understand your point here, Alprova."

My point is that despite any and all efforts to stop torture and to make it patently illegal Internationally, I'm sure that it goes on behind closed doors, even by red-blooded Americans who should know better than to do it.

April 28, 2013 at 9:26 p.m.
jjmez said...

degage said... jjmez, What is your proof?

According to your own federal government investigations. Perhaps you were asleep or not yet born when the reports first came out? Not to mention the several articles written on the subject, with pictures? One of several written by various news outlets/ TIME Mag, May 2004 article-"What Went Wrong In Iraq: Abuses Shock The World" Pictures included.

April 28, 2013 at 9:28 p.m.
alprova said...

Rickaroo wrote: "We would do much better to spend our money, time, and resources making our nation stronger and better internally than going off half-cocked in various countries, where we are only creating more enemies and killing innocent people in the cross-fire."

But Rickaroo, that would mean less money for all the war profiteers and their employees. What are they gonna do?

Case in point;

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2013/04/28/army-says-no-to-more-tanks-but-congress-insists/

"You people who readily justify war and torture are the ones who lack objectivity. You react on raw emotion, waving the flag and thinking that American might always makes right. You can't get any less objective than that."

Like I have typewritten so many times...

Armchair war drum beaters are the absolute worst...

April 28, 2013 at 9:33 p.m.
jjmez said...

alprova said...

Mountainlaurel wrote: "I don’t quite understand your point here, Alprova." My point is that despite any and all efforts to stop torture and to make it patently illegal Internationally, I'm sure that it goes on behind closed doors, even by red-blooded Americans who should know better than to do it.

More often than not, right in America's own backyard, and particuarly in its jails, prisons, on its streets and against American citizens. Most of those involved in the Abu Ghraib scandal were parttime/moonlighting Reservists and Nat'l Guards who in their American civilian roles were jail and prison guards, or police.

April 28, 2013 at 9:35 p.m.
Maximus said...

Is there an exhibit in the Clinton library where they display the jiz stained blue dress of Monica Lewinsky? Where is Monica any way? Hillary and her team of lawyers must have written her a BIG check otherwise she would have written a book and sold exclusive interviews to CNN and TMZ. Guess we will have to wait until the illustrious Clinton's are dead and gone or Monica's gag order expires. Funny, Monica and a gag order. I wonder if they have Bill's pussy smelly cigar on display too. Barry "We Have Defeated Al Quaida" Obama and Slick Willy real men of character. Not.

April 28, 2013 at 11:40 p.m.
Easy123 said...

Maximusty,

You are mentally, intellectually, and socially retarded. Your deranged psychosis has been duly noted as well.

April 28, 2013 at 11:55 p.m.
Maximus said...

Easy.....the truth is painful. You psychobabble stay on message liberals need a reality check. Clinton is a dick and Barry is the lefts female dog. George and Laura Bush will be treated very well in the annals of history. Barry and Jimmy both lauded W as a good man. Of course both of those jokers are very good liars. Carter, a terrible, terrible president and everyone knows it. Carter makes Bush look like George Washington. Again, all you liberal Democrats? Where is Monica? Crickets.........zzzzzzzzzzz

April 29, 2013 at 12:17 a.m.
blackwater48 said...

GIVE IT UP

Bush invaded the wrong country, had over 4,000 of our bravest die for nothing, and bankrupt our nation.

Clinton got caught making booty calls.

Apples and hand grenades.

April 29, 2013 at 12:23 a.m.
Maximus said...

Clinton did use a cigar to, shall we say, stimulate Monica. The truth is eternal. Monica did look sexy in that beret and red lipstick. I think she was barely twenty when she and Bill hooked up. An intern. Wow, send your kid to D.C. as a low paid intern and the President hits on her. Can you imagine the sexual harassment charges. Again, Hillary must have written Monica a check to set her up for life. What are your comments Alprova? Am I accurate?

April 29, 2013 at 12:23 a.m.
Easy123 said...

Maximusty,

You are mentally, intellectually, and socially retarded. Your deranged psychosis has been duly noted again and again.

April 29, 2013 at 12:30 a.m.
Maximus said...

Black water...yes and Clinton let OBL get away. Bush did the right thing in Iraq. We did not get attacked again after 9/11. We will be sending well over 4000 to the middle east very soon probably before Barry's Welfare To The World administration is done. You peace mongers continuing to play the PC game regarding Islamic Terrorism are absolute idiots. The coming war will make Iraq look like A war game.

April 29, 2013 at 12:30 a.m.
Maximus said...

Easy so boring. I guess you are old. Marty Feldman has not made a movie in 25 years and u keep digging up the clip.

April 29, 2013 at 12:33 a.m.

alprova said... Casualties of war is also considered genocide and if you don't believe it, ask any Iraqi who lost loved ones. The fact that it was unintentional does not excuse it one bit.

Genocide is just as wrong and abhorrent whether it's purposely ordered by the leader of sovereign nation on a quest to rule the world, or a happenstance of war ordered by a President of the United States on a quest to bring Democracy to regions of the world who may not have ever experienced it.

The innocent who die are no more or less dead, regardless of what led up to their demise. Those who are still alive are just as grateful to be alive, to at the very least have a chance to piece their broken lives back together.

jjmez said...So the Bush invades and committs an even greater genocide than Hussein's, but you're alright with that? Where's the proof that Hussein committed genocide? There is none.


You people are as dense as bricks. Your ignorance of what genocide actually is exposes the imbecility of your comments or comparisons regarding the Holocaust. Such ignorance, courtesy of Clay Bennett.

http://www.ushmm.org/genocide/take_action/genocide

http://www.upi.com/Top_News/Special/2013/03/08/Kurds-welcome-British-genocide-statement/UPI-63351362762605/

http://www.pbs.org/frontlineworld/stories/iraq203/crossroads03.html

http://www.nytimes.com/2006/04/05/world/05iht-saddam.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0

April 29, 2013 at 12:40 a.m.
Easy123 said...

Maximusty,

"yes and Clinton let OBL get away."

Bullsh!t.

"Bush did the right thing in Iraq."

Certifiable bullsh!t.

"We did not get attacked again after 9/11."

More bullsh!t. How many IED's, car bombs, etc. have killed U.S. soldiers in Iraq and Afghanistan? What about Richard Reid, Jose Padilla, the Lackawanna Six or any number of foiled attacks? The wars in Afghanistan and Iraq haven't deterred any terrorists.

"We will be sending well over 4000 to the middle east very soon probably before Barry's Welfare To The World administration is done."

Wouldn't that be your wet dream?

"You peace mongers continuing to play the PC game regarding Islamic Terrorism are absolute idiots."

You warmongering mouth-breathers are demonstrably ignorant and with a Vanderbilt education no less!

"The coming war will make Iraq look like A war game."

Just keep talking out of your ass. It only serves to discredit you more and more. All of the WingNut "predictions" concerning President Obama have never and will never come true. It's all you have. You cannot discuss reality, so you create your own little world where things happen as you want them to and you can rewrite history. Sorry, you dolt, but that doesn't mean a damn thing here in the real world.

April 29, 2013 at 12:41 a.m.
Easy123 said...

wwwtw,

"You people are as dense as bricks. Your ignorance of what genocide actually is exposes the imbecility of your comments or comparisons regarding the Holocaust. Such ignorance, courtesy of Clay Bennett."

Raphael Lemkin, in his work Axis Rule in Occupied Europe (1944), coined the term "genocide" by combining Greek genos (γένος; race, people) and Latin cīdere (to kill).

Lemkin defined genocide as follows: "Generally speaking, genocide does not necessarily mean the immediate destruction of a nation, except when accomplished by mass killings of all members of a nation. It is intended rather to signify a coordinated plan of different actions aiming at the destruction of essential foundations of the life of national groups, with the aim of annihilating the groups themselves. The objectives of such a plan would be the disintegration of the political and social institutions, of culture, language, national feelings, religion, and the economic existence of national groups, and the destruction of the personal security, liberty, health, dignity, and even the lives of the individuals belonging to such groups."

Sounds familiar. Maybe you're just too willfully ignorant to see the similarities.

April 29, 2013 at 12:50 a.m.
Maximus said...

Oh, oh wait a minute. I thought the entire world, especially the Middle East, would give Obama the healer a great big hug and everyone, especially the Islamic world would love the United States. Well after almost 4 1/2 years of Barry's "It's Our Fault" Foreign Policy we are once again being attacked by radical Islamic terrorists on our own soil ironically in Boston where our independence began. Easy you are right there were several "foiled" terrorist attacks after 9/11, the key word being foiled. We were much, much safer in this country under the leadership team of George W. Bush than we are with the dysfunctional Obama nerds. The ied attacks in Iraq were in a time of war, which of course WAR is a fact weak pricks like Easy can accept.

April 29, 2013 at 12:59 a.m.
Easy123 said...

Maximusty,

"I thought the entire world, especially the Middle East, would give Obama the healer a great big hug and everyone, especially the Islamic world would love the United States."

Why? Did you think those people would just forget about the 10+ years of murder and destruction in their country?

"Well after almost 4 1/2 years of Barry's "It's Our Fault" Foreign Policy we are once again being attacked by radical Islamic terrorists on our own soil ironically in Boston where our independence began."

Guess what their reason was? The war in Iraq and Afghanistan.

"We were much, much safer in this country under the leadership team of George W. Bush than we are with the dysfunctional Obama nerds."

Look up the number killed by terrorist attacks during the Bush administration versus the Obama administration. You will find that you are wrong. But, once again, your idiocy reigns supreme.

"The ied attacks in Iraq were in a time of war, which of course WAR is a fact weak pricks like Easy can accept."

Those attacks happen all the time and they are still occurring all over that region whether a war is going on or not, dumbass. Those terrorists no longer have to come here to kill Americans. They can do it right at home.

I bet you know all about "weak pricks", Maximusty. I bet that was your claim to fame up at Vandy.

April 29, 2013 at 1:09 a.m.
Maximus said...

I bet Hillary wrote Paula Jones a check too. I heard Hillary got an $8 million dollar advance for her upcoming book. I wonder if she will mention Monica and who she will blame Bengazi on? What happened to the guy that made the video which supposedly caused the attack on our embassy? Maybe Hillary will tell us in the book.....right! Don't look for Hillary to donate any of the proceeds from her book to charity, say maybe, the Wounded Warrior Fund or maybe the families of the four killed under her watch in Bengazi. Hillary is high maintenence when it comes to cash. Ya'll she bought Chelsea a $17 million dollar Manhattan condo for a wedding present. Not bad for guvment work! I told y'all it is about getting paid and I gotz tu gets paid tomorrow so I'm am done kicking liberal behind tonight. Good night losers.

April 29, 2013 at 1:11 a.m.
Maximus said...

Easy I had to respond...I know....the number of radical Islamic attacks on innocent people all over the world is the fault of the U. S. and not their belief system. Again I thought Obama was the great savior of America's image all over the world. Rand Paul will do a much better job because the Middle East hates Obama for supporting Israel. I bet that really disappoints you liberals, Obama's support of Israel. The Arabs hate Israel and that my friends is why ghad is being wrought against the West.

April 29, 2013 at 1:20 a.m.
Easy123 said...

Maxipad,

"I told y'all it is about getting paid and I gotz tu gets paid tomorrow so I'm am done kicking liberal behind tonight. Good night losers."

Keep dreaming, our most idiotic of idiots.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8nn0L6055gs

April 29, 2013 at 1:20 a.m.
Easy123 said...

Maximusty,

"Easy I had to respond...I know....the number of radical Islamic attacks on innocent people all over the world is the fault of the U. S. and not their belief system."

Not all of them, but more than any WingNutter, such as yourself, would admit to. Several billion Muslims aren't terrorists despite the misguided, deluded, insane, false teachings of their holy book.

"Again I thought Obama was the great savior of America's image all over the world."

It's hard to repair 10+ years of murder and destruction in 4 years, simpleton.

"Rand Paul will do a much better job because the Middle East hates Obama for supporting Israel."

Rand Paul supports Israel as well, you dolt.

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2013/01/25/rand_paul_us_should_make_clear_any_attack_on_israel_will_be_treated_as_an_attack_on_the_united_states.html

"I bet that really disappoints you liberals, Obama's support of Israel."

Nope. For some reason, it's the American way.

"The Arabs hate Israel and that my friends is why ghad is being wrought against the West."

Or the fact that anyone that isn't Muslim is considered an infidel by radical Islamic terrorists. Or the fact that many millions of said Arabs have been murdered over the years by the United States government. Or maybe the fact that the United States provided money, training and weapons to groups like Al-Queda and the Taliban to kill the Russians. Or any number of other reasons that don't involve Israel.

Would you like to try again?

April 29, 2013 at 1:29 a.m.
alprova said...

It's really hard to take anyone serious who believes that Rand Paul is going to be the next President. I'm sure that he will have his proponents, just like his daddy did, and may even pick up a few percentage points than his father did, but the man will never become President.

He, like his papa, has a past that includes more than a hint of bigotry and kookiness that he refuses to distance himself from.

The Republicans are pulling out anything and everything to attempt to keep Hillary down, but it will fail miserably and she will coast to an easy victory. What they need, they do not have. There is not one potential Republican candidate that has a chance to persuade the nation that he or she will represent all people fairly and impartially.

There are far too many Republicans that still refuse to see that this country has evolved and that the American people are no longer captivated by games of political football.

I've got lots of faithful Republican friends, who all agree with me on that one. If Hillary runs, she's gonna win.

2012 was a monumental election. The Republicans did their level best to prevent a minority of people from being allowed to vote. What happened? They not only jumped through the hoops to overcome that effort to keep them from the polls, then they voted in higher percentages than the white majority that lives in this country.

The Republican Party is way too divided at the moment to begin to pull itself together, to convince the American people that they deserve to be trusted with their votes.

The nation's current atmosphere is simple..."Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me..."

I predicted this more than two years ago. It happens every single time religious conservatives try to wiggle their feet in the door and attempt to seize control of the Republican Party.

Masking themselves as the "Tea Party" worked for awhile but the complete about face and procession after procession of bills only religious conservatives would dare support, and a total abandonment of that which they campaigned and promised to do, if elected, will result in anyone being swiftly dethroned, who stands firm as a Tea Party candidate.

Why else would Maximus devote an entire evening to write about the next President of the United States?

He knows the truth and apparently his hind end is a little chapped at the moment.

April 29, 2013 at 3:46 a.m.
conservative said...

I often check to see who stays up most of the night and sometimes all night. I don't read the comments just the times they comment.

They are surely burdened and weary souls!

Come unto me, all ye that labour and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest.

Take my yoke upon you, and learn of me; for I am meek and lowly in heart: and ye shall find rest unto your souls.

For my yoke is easy, and my burden is light. Mathew 11:28-30

April 29, 2013 at 7:28 a.m.
degage said...

Yep, Max, easy , and al.

April 29, 2013 at 7:47 a.m.
Maximus said...

Alprova, Rand Paul will be one of many excellent Republican candidates for the 2013 election. Of course the Republicans will have a majority in the House and the Senate by then. I wonder if Hillary thought the jiz stained blue dress to be funny or icky?

April 29, 2013 at 8:48 a.m.
Maximus said...

Uh oh I meant 2016 election busy makin money this morning. For losers like Easy and Alprova the food stamps come in today! That's fuuuuuuunny!

April 29, 2013 at 8:51 a.m.
alprova said...

conservative wrote: "I often check to see who stays up most of the night and sometimes all night. I don't read the comments just the times they comment."

You just can't help but to bear false witness, can you? You read every comment just like everyone else does.

"They are surely burdened and weary souls!"

You really think you have a handle on everyone's life, simply by perusing their times they post? How presumptuous you are, with a touch of smug arrogance.

As a matter of fact, I was up at that hour following a family medical emergency. It wasn't my choice or because I have any trouble sleeping.

By the way, just because you believe you are the Father, the Son, and the Holy Ghost reincarnated, it's not up to you to decide when people should be in bed.

You certainly are not my Daddy...

April 29, 2013 at 8:55 a.m.
dude_abides said...

Maximus said... "...busy makin money this morning."

Obviously! You probably have an ipad duct taped to your lawn mower. Considering the food stamps reference you made, you must be doing a bunch of weed-eating around the mailbox.

April 29, 2013 at 9:02 a.m.
degage said...

Al, you are right, your normal time to post is around 9 AM or later. Sorry I lumped you with the all nighters. Hope your medical emergency is resolved.

April 29, 2013 at 9:06 a.m.
alprova said...

"Alprova, Rand Paul will be one of many excellent Republican candidates for the 2016 election. Of course the Republicans will have a majority in the House and the Senate by then."

You do love your world of fantasy.

"I wonder if Hillary thought the jiz stained blue dress to be funny or icky?"

If you are so interested in learning that answer to that question, I urge you to sit down and write a nice letter to her and ask her personally.

It really must irk you to realize that even Presidents are as human as you are, and not Gods without any personal flaws.

You seem to be stuck in a time warp. Most of America has moved on from that which you seem to have on your mind, and have placed the sins of Bill Clinton on a very high shelf where they belong.

As much as you'd like to believe otherwise, you're just a peon with a head full of opinions, and not one of them will change people's minds one bit or prevent what is certain to happen in 2016.

April 29, 2013 at 9:06 a.m.
alprova said...

degage wrote: "Al, you are right, your normal time to post is around 9 AM or later. Sorry I lumped you with the all nighters. Hope your medical emergency is resolved."

I normally go to bed after midnight and I get up at around 9:00 am most days.

Like a lot of people, and due to my own medical maladies, I haven't slept eight hours straight through in the last few years. That aside, I never have a bit of trouble falling asleep whenever I lay my head down.

Thank you degage, my relative is a-okay.

April 29, 2013 at 9:16 a.m.

On Clay Bennett’s Moron Brigade and Gronin’s Law

There are arguments against the wisdom of the allies invading Iraq. Clay’s moron brigade has just discredited them all. You’re out of arguments. You've proven that you know nothing about the Holocaust or genocide. You simply hate Bush, and you offer nothing but broad-brushes and historical ignorance to prop up your hatred. You’ve let it render you incapable of acknowledging Saddam’s genocide against the Kurds. You condemned Reagan and GHW Bush for not intervening in order to stop it. You sighed “Finally!” in support of Clinton’s and GW Bush’s desire to intervene. Then, when intervention proved terribly costly (as many Republicans had predicted throughout the 1990s), you kick back in the Monday morning quarterback recliner and liken the President to Hitler for doing what you bade him do. John Kerry and Hillary Clinton were defeated due to such waffling. Gronin’s law generates web page hits, but the argument they support is thoroughly discredited.

April 29, 2013 at 9:23 a.m.
alprova said...

Maximus wrote: "For losers like Easy and Alprova the food stamps come in today!"

Can someone confirm that to be true? I have no idea what day of the month people receive their monthly allotments of assistance.

My question to Maximus is obvious. How do you know what day of the month TANF funds are loaded onto benefit cards?

"That's fuuuuuuunny!"

Every time you post, you draw that imaginary gun you own from your holster and shoot yourself in the foot.

I'm sure it would be a hoot to learn the truth about you.

April 29, 2013 at 9:37 a.m.
conservative said...

Wow!

There is nothing more powerful than Scripture.

For the word of God is living and active and sharper than any two-edged sword, and piercing as far as the division of soul and spirit, of both joints and marrow, and able to judge the thoughts and intentions of the heart. And there is no creature hidden from His sight, but all things are open and laid bare to the eyes of Him with whom we have to do. Hebrews 4:12-13

Your arrogance and self importance is astonishing alprova. It could be the only reason you would think I read all of your hate filled tomes. I probably do catch most of the ones where you begin addressing me only, although I may have missed some. I don't have a clue or care about your ramblings with others.

I am confident that many here are like me in that once they have determined the character and MO of a frequent commenter they don't bother with reading them or responding to them any longer. It is impossible to not notice a short comment if it is close to the open space when I make mine but I couldn't tell you five minutes later what that one said other than it was something to do with their hatred for God.

You must have a lot of sickness in your family, for you are up all hours of the day and night almost every day commenting here. Why don't you devote those countless hours you waste here to that loved one in need?

April 29, 2013 at 9:57 a.m.
dude_abides said...

WOW! conservative makes light of an illness in alprova's family and thinks God approves. What a hateful, cheap representation of Christianity he exhibits!

April 29, 2013 at 10:53 a.m.
PlainTruth said...

Our president is cool, cute, photogenic, slim, bi-racial....all the cool things. But he's clueless as to governance.

April 29, 2013 at 11:09 a.m.
mountainlaurel said...

Blackwater said to Maximus: “GIVE IT UP. . . Bush invaded the wrong country, had over 4,000 of our bravest die for nothing, and bankrupt our nation. Clinton got caught making booty calls. Apples and hand grenades.”

I seriously doubt that Maximus will take your advice. He has a rather quirky juvenile way of reasoning. In his mind if President A has an illicit affair, it automatically gives his successor President B the right to lie, invade a country, and kill thousands of innocent people.

Unfortunately, a lot of Republicans seem to share this quirky juvenile thinking trait.

In his book, former U.S. Secretary of Treasury, Paul O’Neill said that when he tried to warn Vice President Dick Cheney that growing budget deficits-expected to top $500 billion this fiscal year alone-posed a threat to the economy, Cheney cut him off and said:

"You know, Paul, Reagan proved deficits don't matter." . . ."We won the midterms (congressional elections). This is our due." [Dick Cheney]

April 29, 2013 at 11:10 a.m.
Jt6gR3hM said...

anniebelle said...

Just like with Hitler, we'll remember what these war criminals, bush/cheney, did to our country.


Excellent.

Hitler and Nazi comparisons. They're good for all occasions are they not?

I guess that means you win the debate. Right?

April 29, 2013 at 11:10 a.m.
Jt6gR3hM said...

limric said...

Nice job Clay.

"The receptivity of the masses was very limited, their intelligence is small, but their power of forgetting is enormous."

"In consequence of these facts, all our propaganda was limited to a very few untruths and cheap slogans until the last members of Congress 'understood what we wanted them to understand"

[paraphrased from someone not only smarter than Bush - but even more psychopathic]

It is quite fitting though, don't you think?


More Nazi references.

Why am I not surprised?

April 29, 2013 at 11:14 a.m.
dude_abides said...

whats_up_with_that_brain...

They should have modeled your Fuhrer's liebrary after the Hindenburg (full of hot air), and then moored it somewhere in the skies over Nebraska, where he rode out 9/11!

April 29, 2013 at 11:28 a.m.
Jt6gR3hM said...

Unknown Poster says - "Whatever his faults, only a hateful dunce would compare his presidency to the Holocaust.”

alprova says - “Why don't you hop a plane, land in Iraq, hire an interpreter and query the locals as to how they feel about the United States and who they blame for the deaths of their loved ones? How long do you believe it would be before you are sent home dead in a wooden box, if they returned your body at all?”


alprova - How does your response dispute the first statement and if it did wouldn’t that also apply to most of the central city areas of the U.S.?

April 29, 2013 at 11:33 a.m.
alprova said...

conservative wrote: "Your arrogance and self importance is astonishing alprova. It could be the only reason you would think I read all of your hate filled tomes."

I was not referring to just my comments, you bubble brain. You read EVERY comment posted in here, regardless of what you claim. How do I know this? Because you respond.

"I probably do catch most of the ones where you begin addressing me only, although I may have missed some. I don't have a clue or care about your ramblings with others."

Of course you don't.

"I am confident that many here are like me in that once they have determined the character and MO of a frequent commenter they don't bother with reading them or responding to them any longer."

Uh huh....

"It is impossible to not notice a short comment if it is close to the open space when I make mine but I couldn't tell you five minutes later what that one said other than it was something to do with their hatred for God."

I see, so every comment you do happen to read is an expression of hatred for God?

Do you see flying pink monkeys on a regular basis.

"You must have a lot of sickness in your family, for you are up all hours of the day and night almost every day commenting here."

More false witness. Post the proof. I keep a rather regular schedule. You can tell which days of the week I am home and free to post several times during the day. Most days, after 10:00 am, I am rather busy right up until after 6:00 pm.

Mondays are rather slow, but I am sitting in my office as I type this. Had a few moments to kill.

I do have sickness in my family. Most are elderly. I have health issues myself. I'm touched that you are so concerned with my family.

"Why don't you devote those countless hours you waste here to that loved one in need?"

Why don't you go take a piss on an electric fence?

I take good care of my family, not that it's any of your business.

April 29, 2013 at 11:35 a.m.
Jt6gR3hM said...

dude_abides said...

whats_up_with_that_brain...

They should have modeled your Fuhrer's liebrary after the Hindenburg (full of hot air), and then moored it somewhere in the skies over Nebraska, where he rode out 9/11!


Could you people please keep the goose stepping down to a dull roar?

April 29, 2013 at 11:37 a.m.
whatsnottaken said...

Can't wait to see what revisionist history Tooney comes up with when the Kenyan is gone. I can see it now, Superman in his cape hovering over America and Tooney kissing his ass. HaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHa

April 29, 2013 at 11:37 a.m.
dude_abides said...

jt6gun... Don't you think it's a german (oops) germane reference? I think you're obsessed with whats seen and what's Nazine. You've made no fuhrer than 3 posts noting your touchiness with this subject. There's nothing wrong with us aryan out our feelings on this subject. If you feel sensitive, that's your iron cross to bear.

April 29, 2013 at 11:54 a.m.
conservative said...

alprova,

The reason I engage with you is to expose your false claims of Christianity. If you were an acknowledged Atheist as many who comment here are, I wouldn't bother with you. You are a deceiver so I respond to you only to remind/inform others that you are a practicing Atheist who makes false claims of Christianity.

Have you not noticed that I no longer converse with the regular Atheists like Ikeithlu and easy and have only once or never with the other Atheists who frequent here? Vocal Atheits self destruct, no need for me to read or respond to them.

BTW, in case there might be a new reader here today I will quote some of your past anti Christian rantings:

alprova wrote:

"If you believe the Bible to be 100% accurate in all regards, then you by default believe God to be a mass-murderer."

alprova wrote:

"Was Jesus a perfect man while on Earth? Although few and far between, there is scripture that suggests that Jesus was not perfect."

alprova wrote:

"Did Jesus deceive or lie? One instance in the New Testament seems to offer that he did"

These words of alprova are not his worse!

April 29, 2013 at noon
Easy123 said...

I always laugh when conservative quotes Alprova, yet never offers a word to dispute those very quotes. It's like he thinks he won the argument simply because he provided the quotes.

It's especially funny when conservative refers to Alprova as a "practicing Atheist". The comedy lies in the fact that Alprova is not an Atheist and everyone here knows that based on the beliefs he has shared here numerous times. There is also quite a bit of humor in the phrase "practicing Atheist" itself. Those words are equivalent to saying someone is a practicing non-Astrologer or a practicing non-Alchemist. But what do you expect from an ignorant bigot like conservative?

April 29, 2013 at 12:22 p.m.
mountainlaurel said...

Jt6gR3Hm Says Re: “Whatever his faults, only a hateful dunce would compare his presidency to the Holocaust.”

It’s clear you haven’t thought much about the reprehensible acts committed by the George W. Bush administration. The Geneva Conventions – which ban torture as a war crime – were drafted and adapted by the nations of the world in response to the atrocities of Nazi Germany.

It also clear that you know very little as to what many Jewish people think about the reprehensible acts of the Bush/Cheney administration:

“On behalf of Rabbis for Human Rights—North America, we write out of a deep sense of concern about the erosion of America's longstanding commitment that torture is absolutely reprehensible. . . . What is most disturbing is that . . . the use of torture has been approved at the highest levels of the Administration. “

[Letter to President Bush and members of Congress, January 27, 2005, from more than 500 American rabbis—Orthodox, Conservative and Reform]

April 29, 2013 at 12:27 p.m.
Rickaroo said...

The con-man has stated that he doesn't waste time reading the comments of atheists/agnostics like myself, that he only bothers to look at the hours of their posting. I guess that anyone up in the wee hours must be a slacker/Satanist/late-night partier/druggie/anti-capitalist/whatever? Anyway, I have a few thoughts for you, preacher-boy, if you care to read them. If you don't, well, no skin off my agnostic nose.

Recently there was an article in the paper about a doctor, a self-professed Christian, who was giving up his successful practice and selling his house and literally giving away his possessions so that he and his wife could take up residence in Haiti and help the impoverished people there. If there is such a thing as a true Christian, that, to my mind, would be one. He obviously took Christ's commandment (for those who, like you, actually believe in a literal, historical Christ) to rid yourself of all of your worldly possessions and to follow him. I seriously doubt that the doctor spent his days condemning gays or worrying about whether someone else was a Christian or not, like you do, con-man. He was actually living his faith and expressing his love for humanity, whether they be Christian or non-Christian.

As for your petty concern whether alprova is truly a Christian or not, the very definition of a Christian is an arbitrary one. It was decided by the Council of Nicea, at the instigation of Constantine. The Nicene Creed was devised by man, at least three centuries after Christ supposedly lived, and was decided upon by popular vote among the bishops in attendance. Constantine himself only came to Christianity, not through a spiritual conversion, but because he thought that the symbol of the cross would make him victorious in battle. He even refused to be baptized until he was near death because he wanted to feel free to engage in his various acts of self-serving brutality.

The very definition you use to describe yourself as a Christian is the one that was decided upon at the behest of a military-minded, self-serving ruler, and the only true description of a Christian that comes from the "prince of peace" himself, you shun and would not dare commit yourself to because it would require true love and compassion. You prefer to spend your days judging and calling out "sinners" instead of simply spreading the love. You, sir, are the biggest hypocrite of them all, and you have no right whatsoever to tell anyone else whether they are or are not what they profess to be.

April 29, 2013 at 1:27 p.m.
alprova said...

conservative wrote: "alprova, The reason I engage with you is to expose your false claims of Christianity."

My relationship with God is beween him and myself. What you believe it to be is of no consequence and it never has been.

"If you were an acknowledged Atheist as many who comment here are, I wouldn't bother with you. You are a deceiver so I respond to you only to remind/inform others that you are a practicing Atheist who makes false claims of Christianity."

Screw you and the self-righteous horse you think you rode in on. In MY opinion, you wouldn't know a Christian if one slapped you across the face.

"Have you not noticed that I no longer converse with the regular Atheists like Ikeithlu and easy and have only once or never with the other Atheists who frequent here? Vocal Atheits self destruct, no need for me to read or respond to them."

Sir, you are just full of lies today. It's only been a matter of days since you were stalking Ikeithlu and everyone knows it.

"BTW, in case there might be a new reader here today I will quote some of your past anti Christian rantings:..."

(snipped)

Sir, the challenge is still on the table for you to disprove one word I have written that you disagree with or consider blasphemous on my part.

I like it when you quote my words, for they are the absolute truth and given that you have not to date refuted, explained, or clarified one sentence I have posted that can be found in the Bible, leaves you looking rather silly.

You are entitled to disagree with anything I have ever written, but you still cannot disprove a doggone thing I have written, so they remain factual and correct.

April 29, 2013 at 2:39 p.m.
magenta said...

MaxiMoosey said... Bush did the right thing in Iraq. We did not get attacked again after 9/11.

There was no need for another 9/11 when the first one gotcha' right where the Bush's and his Saudi friends wantedcha, and got the Bush right where he'd planned on going the moment he entered office. Iraq. The Bush said: "Give me something, ANYTHING, to justify invading Iraq." Someone gave him 9/11/2001. :(

April 29, 2013 at 2:55 p.m.
Leaf said...

I'm no fan of W, that poor benighted buffoon, but even I think this cartoon is in poor taste. Yes, I get the metaphor but it still induced a cringe and a "Don't go there, Clay."

There will be a lot of people who will come to the conclusion that Clay is directly comparing W. and Hitler. I think he meant it as a comment on the appropriateness of a memorial to a bad thing. Like a cautionary memorial.

Apologies if I'm restating something said earlier, I haven't had time to read the posts.

April 29, 2013 at 3:33 p.m.
acerigger said...

Well worth reading,"50 Reasons You Despised George W. Bush's Presidency: A Reminder on the Day of His Presidential Library Dedication"

http://www.alternet.org/news-amp-politics/50-reasons-you-despised-george-w-bushs-presidency-reminder-day-his-presidential?paging=off

(Just in case you've forgotten,or didn't know)

April 29, 2013 at 3:35 p.m.
Maximus said...

Mag...your point? Bush kicked ass in Iraq and I bet he sleeps better than Hillary. Wow what a great job Hillary did handling the Libya and Syria issues as Barry's token SOS. Hillary is just soooooo smart. On the 2016 presidential candidate front I wonder if John Edwards will give it another run or is he too busy knocking up another photo journalist. :)

April 29, 2013 at 3:49 p.m.
Leaf said...

Wow, maximus REALLY doesn't like women. I'm guessing he doesn't get much play. Shocker, that.

April 29, 2013 at 3:53 p.m.
conservative said...

alprova, "but you still cannot disprove a doggone thing I have written, so they remain factual and correct."

What hubris! What arrogance!

As I have said in the past your own words reveal that you are not a Christian. No Christian assembly of believers would ever accept you as a member knowing the anti Christian statements you have made.

Your statements such as:

"Jesus did indeed sin" and "Jesus can not be God" are proof enough that you are not a Christian. Christians would be taken aback to say the least if you made that statement before an assembly of Christians of whom you were seeking membership.

Yes, those two statements are meaningless to vocal and practicing Atheists here, I can't help that. Even proof will not convince them.

However, here is Scriptural proof that Jesus did not sin:

" For you have been called for this purpose, since Christ also suffered for you, leaving you an example for you to follow in His steps, who committed no sin, nor was any deceit found in His mouth;" 1 Peter 2:22

"Everyone who practices sin also practices lawlessness; and sin is lawlessness. You know that He appeared in order to take away sins; and in Him there is no sin."1John3:4-5

Of course there are others, but you will not accept them either.

This is why your own quotes are sufficient to convict you.

You wrote: "Jesus can not be God." Christians know that Jesus was God manifested in the flesh. Jesus is second in the Trinity. God the Father, God the Son and God the Holy Spirit.

"In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. He was in the beginning with God. All things came into being through Him, and apart from Him nothing came into being that has come into being." John 1:1-3

"And the Word became flesh, and dwelt among us, and we saw His glory, glory as of the only begotten from the Father, full of grace and truth." John1:14

Now, either you are right or God is right!

"All Scripture is inspired by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, for training in righteousness; so that the man of God may be adequate, equipped for every good work." 2Timothy 3:16-17

Your problem is not that you are just ignorant of Christianity but hostile to Christianity!!!

April 29, 2013 at 3:53 p.m.
Rickaroo said...

"Bush kicked ass in Iraq." - Maximus

That's funny. Maximouse has said that repeatedly. I guess he's trying to convince himself. Bush SHOWED his ass when made the premature statement of "Mission accomplished," but he didn't engage in any ass kicking at all. I would like for Maximouse to tell us how exactly Iraq was so ass-kickingly defeated. Just deposing a dictator does not constitute victory. Just bombing a country into near-oblivion does not constitute victory. Just occupying a country with tens of thousands of troops and killing more innocent people than enemy combatants does not constitute victory. We are a nation that still worries about another terrorist attack and we have sacrificed many of our freedoms in our hyper-vigilance. So we obviously did not "win" the war on terror by declaring war on Iraq and maintaining a presence there for ten long years. Maximouse only shows his stupidity when he utters such nonsense. But then, he shows it with practically everything he says anyway. What a sick little prick.

April 29, 2013 at 4:12 p.m.
Jt6gR3hM said...

EaTn said...

When the Iraq smoke finally settles and the head count is reliably complete, the Christians in this country will be shocked to learn of the tens of thousands Christians martyred there due to the failed Bush invasion.


Blaming the victims?

So Islamists murdering their fellow countrymen and women for the simple fact that they have religious hatred against them is somehow the fault of President Bush? It couldn’t be that he conveniently provided them the opportunity to carry out their evil that they would have found some other reason to accomplish anyway?

April 29, 2013 at 4:25 p.m.
magenta said...

Maximus said... Mag...your point? Bush kicked ass in Iraq and I bet he sleeps better than Hillary.

The fact that you actually believe that shows you haven't a clue. The Bush didn't kick ass in Iraq. He invaded a sovereign, secular nation, and once ally, that had nothing to do with terrorists, terrorism or WMD, and a lot to do with virgin, untapped oil wells and a personal vendetta. All he accomplished was to place the world in greater danger and create more terrorists.

April 29, 2013 at 4:34 p.m.
Rickaroo said...

There is NOTHING good that has come out of our war in Iraq. Some people think that just getting rid of Saddam was reason enough to declare war, because he was a despicable tyrant who carried out genocide on his own people. But Iraq has never been anything more than a region composed of warring factions of dark-age religious tribes. They have been warring against and killing each other for centuries and will no doubt continue doing so long after we're gone. The entire Mideast is much more unstable now, with Saddam gone, than it was when he was in power. Furthermore, another ruthless dictator just as unsavory as Saddam will most likely take the reins soon after we make our exit. Bush's war on Iraq was needless, self-serving, completely insane, and a total failure. Only a fool and a complete idiot would call the war in Iraq a success.

April 29, 2013 at 4:56 p.m.
GratefulDawg said...

"I often check to see who stays up most of the night and sometimes all night. I don't read the comments just the times they comment. --conservative"

Connie's house must look like a NFL franchise "war room" on draft day. He has his big board of heathens. Two stacks of bible verses, those that he quotes frequently and another stack off in a far corner that he ignores completely. Now he is punching us all in and out on some kind of time clock in a system that only makes sense to him. He's a strange little bugger ain't he?

He's makin' a list, the bible he'll leaven, gonna find out who's gettin' to heaven...

April 29, 2013 at 4:59 p.m.
PlainTruth said...

STFO of Syria

April 29, 2013 at 5:01 p.m.
conservative said...

alprova,

Scripture proves that you are hostile to Christianity and your own words prove that you are hostile to Christianity. You wrote:

"Jesus did indeed sin"

"Jesus can not be God",

"Jesus was simply a human."

Now, those short blasphemous statements of yours stand out don't they? They indict/convict you, you know this, and that is why you keep trying red herrings. I dare say many more read this comment than my last.

April 29, 2013 at 5:11 p.m.
limric said...

Jt6gR3hM,

Surprised (feigned?) you say? I’m sure you would be; for the differences between the statement I proffered and the ‘propaganda, untruths and cheap slogans’ used to such masterful effect in the run-up to Shock & Awe were frighteningly small and shockingly similar.

My description is fitting testament to a Texas Mafia that caused all other crime syndicates to give the appearance of rank amateurs.

April 29, 2013 at 5:11 p.m.
timbo said...

blackwater48....Typical method used by liberals. You, Bennett and the rest are so intellectually stunted you don't have any other way except to insult.

First of all, they were opinions. Second I said that Bush screwed up on Iraq. I am not sure the psychology Mr.Blackwater Freud but it didn't matter about the weapons we just had no right to do it.

Now as far as deficits go, as usual you little libs don't use numbers you just use "The Wall Street Journal..reported that the Deficit has been shrinking A LOT even before sequestration kicks in." Wow..is a "A LOT" more than a GaZillion? "A LOT" is not a number.

So, let me give you the correct numbers and maybe this "troll" can enlighten you.

President Barack Obama: First Term Total = $5.073 trillion. FY 2013 - $901 billion. FY 2012 - $1.327 trillion. FY 2011 - $1.299 trillion. FY 2010 - $1.546 ($1.293 trillion plus $253 billion from the Obama Stimulus Act that was attached to the FY 2009 budget).

President George W. Bush: First Term = $1.267 trillion. Second Term = $2.027 trillion. Total = $3.294.

FY 2009 - $1.16 trillion. ($1.416 trillion minus $253 billion from Obama's Stimulus Act) FY 2008 - $458 billion. FY 2007 - $161 billion. FY 2006 - $248 billion. FY 2005 - $318 billion. FY 2004 - $413 billion. FY 2003 - $378 billion. FY 2002 - $158 billion.

Now, since you have the real numbers you can see that Obama deficits totaled 1.779 trillion more than Bush's deficits. That included the stupid stimulus that almost everyone says did no good. Bush's last deficit included the stupid bank bailout that Obama was for by the way.

The deficits going "down" is insignificant. Without them disappearing and unless we start running surpluses, the actual debt can never be paid down. I guess I wrongly assumed that you imbeciles can add and subtract.

So, you and the rest of you liberal piss ants wouldn't know the truth if it bit you. Blackwater48..you are just a know-nothing punk.

April 29, 2013 at 5:17 p.m.
Jt6gR3hM said...

magenta said...

Bush came into office with the intent of invading Iraq. Remember him saying to his advisors: "Give me something ANYTHING to justify going into Iraq.


I can’t seem to find any record of that sentence being uttered by President Bush but I’m sure you have a reliable source and can provide it to me. Right?

April 29, 2013 at 5:35 p.m.
Maximus said...

Rickaroo I hear you are dating the NBA player that came out of the closet today. Gives new meaning to the back door pass. Leafy....Hillary is not a woman that I would take a second look at even when she was young and playing field hockey at Yale. I thought it curious that while all you losers were gorging yourselfs with your Bushapalooza, (y'all have had plenty of practice over the past ten years) no one came to the defense of Bill Clinton and the cum stained blue dress. Hmmmm. And how about Obama's library ceremony in a few years. It will have a special wing called the Obama Care Trainwreck Theater featuring a special video with scary Nancy Pelosi saying .........first we must pass the bill before we know what's in it. There will also be a "it was all Bushes fault" wing right next to the Bengazi Cover Up video hall. Throughout the Obama library there will be audio playing ....Bengazi, Fort Hood, and the Boston Bombings were isolated criminal responses to George Bush and definitely not attacks on the west by Radical Islamic Terrorists. Radical Islamic Terrorists do not exist. Finally there will be a special fountain honoring the NRA. It will depict NRA leader Wayne Lapierre kicking Obama' ass. A really moving display.

April 29, 2013 at 6:02 p.m.
magenta said...

For Jt6gR3hM. See "The Price Of Loyalty" by Ron Suskind

Interviews with former Bush Treasury Secretary Paul O'Neill and with numerous participants in the Bush administration, by transcripts of meetings. and by voluminous documents. An interview with O'Neill on 60 minutes, 2004 article on CNN and a host of other news outlets.

I know! I know! You'll likely say O'Neill was just another disgruntled employee because was asked to resign back in Dec. 2002 because he disagreed with Bush plans on tax cuts yada yada.

NY Times as well carried an article back in 2002 or2004?.

excerpt:

"Suskind documents that in the first three months of 2001 revealed the Bush administration was examining military options for removing Saddam Hussein" "There are memos," Suskind told CBS. "One of them marked 'secret' says 'Plan for Post-Saddam Iraq. Another Pentagon document entitled "Foreign suitors for Iraqi Oil Field Contracts" talks about contractors from 40 countries and which ones have interest in Iraq, Suskind said."

April 29, 2013 at 6:19 p.m.
Maximus said...

Oh gee I almost forgot there will also be a Disability Hall of Fame and a special Wall Of The Unemployed at the Obama library paying tribute to all of the Americans laid off during the transformative Obama years. An interactive thrill ride will also be available for kids allowing them to ride on the back of a drone while it fires missiles at normal Muslim criminals on foreign soil..not radical Islamic Terrorists because again such terrorists do not exist. The tour of the Obama library will end in the Michelle Obama garden where a 3D life size figure of Michelle wearing Gucci and Cartier will tell you what to eat, special assistance was provided by NY Mayor Michael Bloomberg on this empowering project.

April 29, 2013 at 6:27 p.m.
MickeyRat said...

Ya got nothin, don't ya Max. Your twisted diversions are all pussy chickenhawks like you can do. But then, you've got to do something to make for a small....
I bet you can't even see your junk over you belly can you?

April 29, 2013 at 7:14 p.m.
Maximus said...

Mickey thanks for reminding me about other attractions at the Obama library and museum. The AG Eric Holder Fast and Furious gun range featuring guns from Mexico and one of the more popular attractions the Janet Napolitano Ice Cream Parlor and the Hillary Clinton Casino where liars are welcome. Oh the times you unemployed liberals will have at the Obama Library paid for by George Soros and several influential gays still in the closet....hint...most of Obama's current cabinet not that there is anything wrong with that. American flag burnings will be held promptly at sun up and sun down as a resoundiing symbol of the fall of American exceptionalism during the Obama years. Fun times.

April 29, 2013 at 7:50 p.m.
Easy123 said...

timboner,

"Now, since you have the real numbers you can see that Obama deficits totaled 1.779 trillion more than Bush's deficits.'

Yet, just as blackwater48 said, deficits have been going down. I repeat, deficits have been going down under President Barack Obama.

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/politics/red-ink-alarmists-gop-warnings-deficit-article-1.1285902

http://news.investors.com/blogs-capital-hill/112012-634082-federal-deficit-falling-fastest-since-world-war-ii.htm

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/02/05/budget-deficit-trillion-cbo_n_2623910.html

"That included the stupid stimulus that almost everyone says did no good."

No serious economist or human being says the Stimulus did no good. The Stimulus added and saved over 3 million jobs. The Stimulus put money in areas that will help the United States grow in the long term like infrastructure and sustainable energy.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/wonkblog/post/did-the-stimulus-work-a-review-of-the-nine-best-studies-on-the-subject/2011/08/16/gIQAThbibJ_blog.html

http://www.citytowninfo.com/career-and-education-news/articles/cbo-report-shows-stimulus-plan-had-positive-effects-on-economy-10083001

http://articles.latimes.com/2012/may/03/business/la-fi-fitch-stimulus-20120503

http://www.politico.com/news/stories/1111/68965.html

"The deficits going "down" is insignificant."

Considering that is what blackwater48 was saying, I think it's pretty significant, dumbass.

"Without them disappearing and unless we start running surpluses, the actual debt can never be paid down"

Actually, the more deficits decrease, the closer the United States gets to "running surpluses" and "paying down" that debt, you freaking moron.

"I guess I wrongly assumed that you imbeciles can add and subtract."

I've never once been wrong about your ignorance. You have shown it again today. You obviously don't know that if you subtract enough, you get down to zero, but I knew you couldn't add or subtract. You're timboner. It's part of your "dumbass" routine.

"So, you and the rest of you liberal piss ants wouldn't know the truth if it bit you."

So, you and the rest of your WingNut knuckle-dragging-morons can keep trying to invent your own version of the truth. And I'll keep sending you back to the kids table with no desert. You know nothing of the truth. You never have and you never will. It's a foreign idea to you. Other ideas that are foreign to you are intelligence and logic.

"Blackwater48..you are just a know-nothing punk."

Such an ironic statement coming from the ignorant son of a bitch that literally knows nothing about the subjects he posts about. Everything you say is either fallacious or false. I cannot reiterate enough how patently ignorant you are. Lies are not truth and strawman arguments does not a sound rebuttal make.

Would you like to have another go at it?

April 29, 2013 at 7:55 p.m.
Jt6gR3hM said...

magenta:

Remember, you claimed that President Bush actually said “Give me something ANYTHING to justify going into Iraq.”

I’m sure your opinion is that he meant this by his actions and statements but it is just your opinion after all and I need collaborated proof. I await your reply containing this proof.

April 29, 2013 at 8:04 p.m.
magenta said...

Jt6gR3hM, I've given all the information. All you have to do is pick up a book, search the articles and READ! READ! READ! Remember, reading is F u N d A m E n T a L

Now, isntead of wasting your precious time trying to discredit everyone and boost your Bushy's image, take time to educate yourself.

April 29, 2013 at 8:20 p.m.
alprova said...

conservative wrote: "What hubris! What arrogance!"

It's not arrogant to relate verifiable facts. It is arrogance to pretend that they are not and to condemn me for relating them.

"Christians would be taken aback to say the least if you made that statement before an assembly of Christians of whom you were seeking membership."

Not all Christians hold Calvinist beliefs.

"Yes, those two statements are meaningless to vocal and practicing Atheists here, I can't help that. Even proof will not convince them."

You have no proof. If you did, then refuting my various statements would be a snap. As it is, the statements I have offered that upset you are absolutely found within and come straight from the Bible.

"However, here is Scriptural proof that Jesus did not sin" (snipped)

That is proof of nothing. I've cited much scripture that suggests that Jesus did sin. Read them for yourself;

Matthew 12:1-6, Luke 6:1-5, Matthew 23:13-36, Mark 11:15, Matt 21:12-15, Luke 19:45-47, John 2:14-16, Mark 11:2-4, Matt 21:2-3, Luke 19:30-31, John 18:19-20, Matthew 21:21-22, Matthew 7:7-8, Matthew 18:19-20, Mark 11:24-25, Luke 11:9-13, John 14:13-14, John 15:7, John 15:16, John 16:23-24, and John 7:1-10.

There's much, much more. Read them or don't read them. Jesus was human and just as real as you and I, and not perfect.

Yes he died for our sins. He is alleged to sit on the right-hand side of God as we are discussing all this. He may well be a perfect being TODAY. But while he was on Earth, he was very much a human and nowhere near perfect. Deal with it.

"This is why your own quotes are sufficient to convict you."

You simply cannot accept that there are many written opinions contained in the Bible...not statements of fact. Context, context, context. Controversy is rampant throughout the Bible.

You're a Calvinist. I reject Calvinism outright. You need to deal with that too.

"You wrote: "Jesus can not be God." Christians know that Jesus was God manifested in the flesh. Jesus is second in the Trinity. God the Father, God the Son and God the Holy Spirit."

That is pure Calvinism. It is not a shared belief by all Christians.

"Now, either you are right or God is right!"

God is right and he does not claim to be Jesus.

The founders of Roman Catholicism edited the Bible at the Council of Nicaea in 325. The complete manuscript of the Latin Vulgate Bible was completed in 382. Pope Damascus 1 commissioned St. Jerome to translate the Bible into Latin. Thus, the Trinity was born, more than three centuries after Jesus was crucified.

"Your problem is not that you are just ignorant of Christianity but hostile to Christianity!!!"

Sir, I don't know how many times you have made that baseless statement and it will never be true, no matter how many more times you type it.

Please...piss up a rope for all I care. Your condemnations are highly misplaced and most irrelevant.

April 29, 2013 at 8:21 p.m.
conservative said...

alprova.

Jesus said:

"But I say unto you, That every idle word that men shall speak, they shall give account thereof in the day of judgment."

"For by thy words thou shalt be justified, and by thy words thou shalt be condemned."Mathew 12:36-37

You said:

"Face the truth for once in your life. God is a murderer and a mass-murderer at that...IF THE BIBLE IS ACCURATE."

"Your belief in the Bible as a literal work of God locks you into the belief that God is a mass-murder, whether you admit it or not. My belief that the Bible is not the word of God, and instead is the work of many men, frees me from that belief."

"My belief that the Bible is not the word of God in no manner is equal to holding any contempt for it."

"I do not and never will hold the belief that the Bible is the word of God. You will not shame me into such a belief, no matter how many times you try."

April 29, 2013 at 8:23 p.m.
alprova said...

Easy123 asked Timbo: "Would you like to have another go at it?"

Uh...I'll bet that he'll slink of into the sunset, after that thrashing...

I shake my head at those who believe that the stimulus that President Obama did nothing at all for the economy. Every expert contradicts that firmly and authoritatively.

Folks also forget that much of the spending that occurred after Obama took office, and is still being spent, was put in motion and signed by GWB before he left office.

The Republicans have had control of the House for two years and counting. Has one bill been introduced to stop stimulus funding put in motion in 2008? Nope.

Anti-Obamans are so transparent.

April 29, 2013 at 8:32 p.m.
gypsylady said...

Minimus - why so much time posting? Don't you have some silt fences to install?

April 29, 2013 at 8:57 p.m.
Maximus said...

Much of Obama spending had been put in motion by GWB. Alprova you need to either come out of the closet and express your manlove for Obama or get off the METH. Barry The Welfare Pimp has spent more money than all U.S. presidents combined. You are a Radical Obamic Terrorist and your brain is soaked with social justice mania . All this talk of Islamic love has brought me to an epiphany......they aren't mad at us because of GW, who by the way looks very comfortable with the rapid rise in his approval ratings, it's about the Crusades. Radical Islamic Terrorists are killing Christians all over the world. Again, not all Muslims just the nutcase jihadists. I so respect my Muslim brothers and sisters more than any trashy secular humanist atheist. After all, it is a certainty that atheists are going to hell. I know right, I'm on a roll this evening.

April 29, 2013 at 9:18 p.m.
Easy123 said...

The last time Maximus had an epiphany, he was climbing off his sister.

April 29, 2013 at 9:30 p.m.
Jt6gR3hM said...

alprova said...

“do you ever take notice that hardly anyone has much of an issue with the military efforts in Afghanistan?”


That’s a joke. Right?

April 29, 2013 at 9:43 p.m.
alprova said...

Thank you conservative for posting my quotes.

Can you refute them at all? I have invited you repeatedly to convince me that I am wrong. Quoting cherry-picked scripture, taken completely out of context from an imperfect Bible is not going to convince me of a thing.

Controversy runs rampant throughout the Bible. Surely a man with your convictions that you are an upstanding Calvin Christian can use your own words to attempt to refute my statements of fact.

Say a prayer to ask for the right words to type. Didn't Jesus say repeatedly throughout the New Testament that if you ask the Father in the name of Jesus, that your request would be granted?

I'm sure you will renew your accusations that I am a blasphemer after reading what I am about to type, but how many people, many who were faithful Christians like you believe yourself to be, have prayed in the name of Jesus for God to save their loved ones from imminent death, to have those prayers denied? Do you think you are capable of counting that high? Was Jesus being dishonest when making that repeated promise? Isn't dishonesty a sin?

Anyone can read in the Bible the testimonial that God indiscriminately wiped out the lives of all men, women, children, and animal life, save but for one family and two of every species of animal. Is that not mass-murder? What do you call it? A demonstration of God's love for his creation?

If you do one thing, explain why it is that God wiped out the lives of children and animals, along with all those "evil" adults.

Your belief that the Bible is the word of God is very different from people being inspired by God to write individual letters that make up the vast majority of the Bible. The Bible has been altered, edited, and mistranslated many times since it was originally put together. Books have been added, removed, and totally created from scratch. The authors expressed many opinions in what they wrote and very few facts.

I have told you many times to believe whatever you wish. Your chosen beliefs are not shared by all, and they are not shared by more than a couple of people who have ever participated in this forum.

Keep posting my statements, stalker. Everything I have ever written is justified and can be read by anyone interested enough to do so for themselves in the Bible, that you consider to be "God's Word."

Always remember, that it is YOU who is bound by YOUR belief that the Bible is the word of God. I am not bound by any standard of belief that YOU have chosen to adopt on a personal level.

Biblical quotations will henceforth be promptly ignored. You are convinced that you have a full grasp on what constitutes a Christian.

Now prove it using your own words.

April 29, 2013 at 9:54 p.m.
Jt6gR3hM said...

Unknown Poster said - "President Bush was in office only, thanks to al gore, 5 months before 9/11."

alprova said - “You were never proficient when doing simple arithmetic, were you?

January 20, 2001 to September 11, 2001 was nine days short of eight months in office.”

“I'm not about to get into some silly pissing contest with you over any of this.”


Sure sounds like a nit picking pissing contest to me.

April 29, 2013 at 9:58 p.m.
Jt6gR3hM said...

alprova said …

But none were found in 2003, 15 years later, and you can pound your fist on a table all day long, but everyone knows who led the charge to invade Iraq on March 20, 2003 and what it was based upon. It sure wasn't due to any statement by Clinton, Kerry, Pelosi, or any other Democrat you can name.


The statements by those people plus many more provided much of the justification and support for going to war. They gave the impression to the public that there was little doubt that Iraq had WMD’s and that military action was a bipartisan effort.

April 29, 2013 at 10:14 p.m.
alprova said...

Maximus wrote: "Much of Obama spending had been put in motion by GWB. Alprova you need to either come out of the closet and express your manlove for Obama or get off the METH."

Can you disprove my statement or are you just going to drop a bomb and forget to flush?

Read it and weep;

http://factcheck.org/2012/06/obamas-spending-inferno-or-not/

"Barry The Welfare Pimp has spent more money than all U.S. presidents combined."

Another turd.

http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2011/jun/01/sarah-palin/sarah-palin-says-obama-has-accumulated-more-debt-p/

"You are a Radical Obamic Terrorist and your brain is soaked with social justice mania ."

I have no idea what that means. Try posting in English.

"All this talk of Islamic love has brought me to an epiphany......"

And what would that be?

"they aren't mad at us because of GW, who by the way looks very comfortable with the rapid rise in his approval ratings,"

A Fox News poll, consisting of mostly Republican respondents is not any gauge that GWB's reputation is out of the crapper. The day that one current Republican candidate running for political office invites GWB to stand up next to them on a stage, THEN let's revisit the subject.

"it's about the Crusades. Radical Islamic Terrorists are killing Christians all over the world."

Oh...I'm sure that a few Atheists and Agnostics have been killed as well.

"I so respect my Muslim brothers and sisters more than any trashy secular humanist atheist."

I'm sure that Atheists all over the world break their legs, tripping after seeking the honor of your respect.

"After all, it is a certainty that atheists are going to hell."

If so, it will be right behind a long line of so-called, self-righteous Christians.

"I know right, I'm on a roll this evening."

Wow!! I had no idea you had a fat wife. Roll her in some flour.

April 29, 2013 at 10:36 p.m.
Jt6gR3hM said...

alprova said...

Pardon me rick1, but I was totally unaware that Cindy Sheehan was still camped out in Crawford, Texas, and that the media simply wasn't covering it any longer, now that Obama is in the House.


It would appear to be obvious that she is not camped at Crawford, Texas since Bush no longer lives there nor is he still the president. However she has been very active protesting Obama but the MSM has given her little if any coverage. I wonder why.


From Wiki:

“In August 2009, Sheehan protested at Martha's Vineyard during President Barack Obama's stay there.

On October 5, 2009, Sheehan was arrested with 60 others at the White House protesting President Obama's continuation of wars in Iraq and Afghanistan.

On December 10, 2009, Sheehan protested on the streets of Oslo, Norway, as President Barack Obama accepted the Nobel Peace Prize.

On March 20, 2010, Sheehan was again arrested in front of the White House, along with seven others, after they defied orders by officers of the United States Park Police to clear the sidewalk on Pennsylvania Avenue.

On May 2, 2011, Sheehan released a statement indicating that she considers the death of Osama bin Laden to be a hoax, stating: "If you believe the newest death of OBL, you’re stupid."

In October 2011, Sheehan was arrested in Sacramento as part of an anti–Wall Street movement.

Despite agreeing to stand as the Socialist Party USA's vice presidential nominee for the 2012 elections, the party's national convention voted on October 15, 2011, to block her candidacy, on the official grounds that she isn't a member of the party.


It appears that after 2011 she decided that the MSM had completely abandoned her and her efforts to protest are becoming less and less. She’s been used up and discarded.

April 29, 2013 at 11:01 p.m.
Maximus said...

It seems the Obama press corp has placed the Boston bombing on page two with the American low information Obama voter like Alprova, mark my word, the Boston bombers were trained by a radical Islamic terrorist cell and Obama is doing everything possible to cover it up just like Hillarys flag drapped coffin performance art. Also, Obama will be putting American boots on the ground very soon in Syria. American special forces operators are already prepping in Jordan. Just like when Clinton bombed Serbia bombs will be dropping soon in Syria. Invest in defense stocks now. General Dynamics, Barrett Arms, and GE are good stock plays now. The jokes Obama told at the recent press club dinner had hidden meaning. Watch it carefully. Obama is also still active in Afghanistan. Whatever George Soros wants George Soros gets. Obama is his BIATCH no matter what the leftist sponsored fact check says more poor unfortunate Obama drones are on food stamps and disability than ever before and that's a fact jack. Obviously Alprova is anti Semitic and a pathetic example of what is wrong with the left. Like Tamerlans Mom said.....and Alprova believes,,, if its on the net it must be true. Alprova must have attended public schools.....figures right. Baylor, McCaulley, or GPS are your only education options in Chatt. Otherwise state run public schools will turn your kid into a simple minded leftist loser like Alprova and others.

April 29, 2013 at 11:39 p.m.
Maximus said...

Curious Alprova uses a Disney cartoon character as his icon. Could Alprova be a creepy pedifile? More than likely I would say. Alprova a card carrying member of NAMBLA. What else could be behind his lefty love fest with Barry The Welfare Pimp? Ahhhhhhhh yes gay rights is Alprovnothings hot button and he gets his button punched regularly by his life partner. Gross man, really gross.

April 29, 2013 at 11:52 p.m.
alprova said...

Jt6gR3hM wrote: "It would appear to be obvious that she is not camped at Crawford, Texas since Bush no longer lives there nor is he still the president. However she has been very active protesting Obama but the MSM has given her little if any coverage. I wonder why."

Apparently, the woman abandoned all sense of reason. People tend to yawn anymore when the news consists of someone defying a lawful order by an officer of the law, and depictions of those who spout conspiracy theories. It would have been more preferable that she conduct herself in a lawful manner, and to have done her level best to refrain from adopting theories of outrageous conspiracies.

Cindy Sheehan was driven mad by the loss of her son. I fully sympathize with and understand everything she has done. I too buried a son and a wife 36 years ago. I went out of my mind for a few years as a result of their untimely deaths.

News is only news for so long, and as someone pointed out yesterday, the timeline for ending of the Iraq war was basically set in stone before Obama took office.

Protesting the current President was highly misplaced, for he was bound by the SOFA Agreement signed by GWB two months prior to Obama's election. He honored it.

"It appears that after 2011 she decided that the MSM had completely abandoned her and her efforts to protest are becoming less and less. She’s been used up and discarded."

Was she used? I'm sure she was. But it was not the media who used her. She was used by war protesters. When her newsworthiness died, they are the ones who discarded her.

April 29, 2013 at 11:59 p.m.
alprova said...

Maximus wrote: "Curious Alprova uses a Disney cartoon character as his icon."

Where in the world did you learn how to write a sentence?

"Could Alprova be a creepy pedifile (sic)?"

The word is spelled "pedophile," Mr. Venderbilt grad...

Wanna try that excuse that you were typing too fast on this one?

"More than likely I would say."

Is this where I am supposed to get mad and threaten you or something? [Yawn...]

"Alprova a card carrying member of NAMBLA."

Gee...I wasn't under the impression that the organization issued membership cards. Is this another one of your absent-minded, projecting admissions?

"What else could be behind his lefty love fest with Barry The Welfare Pimp?"

I've written it before and it bears repeating now. If you were a pimple on the President's ass, he would pop you and wipe the residue that once was you away with an alcohol pad and dispose of you in a gold plated trash can.

"Ahhhhhhhh yes gay rights is Alprovnothings hot button and he gets his button punched regularly by his life partner. Gross man, really gross."

You have not grown up very much, mentally, since grade school, have you?

You're not very prophetic, but you are nothing short of pathetic.

April 30, 2013 at 12:18 a.m.
alprova said...

Nooga wrote: "MyMymaximus tic,toc"

That's an insult to mymy, wherever she may be...

Maximus was born when Toes02800 died on November 6, 2012.

April 30, 2013 at 12:30 a.m.
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